Oxalic Treatment and Timing

[ianorsven]

Despite the mild weather and despite low varroa counts (drops from 3 hives of 0, 1 and 5 over a nine day period) I decided to go ahead with OA treatment. In the past I have had hives with low varroa counts and delayed treating (see beebase calculator!) which consequently failed and DWV prevalent.

I have insulated roofs but did not expect the high level of activity I found! Bees strolling around and some flying - one even brought pollen back. Very pleased to see 7, 8 and 9 seams of bees and sealed stores on tops of frames. Trickled warmed OA syrup from Thornes quickly, hefted and decided to give the lightest hive rolls of fondant between the bars. First time I've tried this. Rolled like plastercine and pushed down between the bars so crownboard went back on with no gap.

Felt like a beekeeper again!

Remembered hiving one of these colonies on May 1st last year - it was 8 centigrade then and warmer than that today!!

 

[Pete D]

Just checked my hives I did last Sunday, drops between 5 and 40 with most hives having less than 20. Will check again next week.

 

[Vramin]

I have checked my monitoring board regularly and found I had a drop of 8 over a 14 day period. The Beebase Varroa Calculator suggests I have 140 mites in my one hive and that any necessary treatment should be undertaken in 5 month's time.

CVB

One of my hives had precisely the same drop as you, and 4 days after treating I have counted 235 mites, with more expected over the next few weeks.

 

[charlievictorbravo]

Despite the mild weather and despite low varroa counts (drops from 3 hives of 0, 1 and 5 over a nine day period) I decided to go ahead with OA treatment. In the past I have had hives with low varroa counts and delayed treating (see beebase calculator!) which consequently failed and DWV prevalent.

I have insulated roofs but did not expect the high level of activity I found! Bees strolling around and some flying - one even brought pollen back. Very pleased to see 7, 8 and 9 seams of bees and sealed stores on tops of frames. Trickled warmed OA syrup from Thornes quickly, hefted and decided to give the lightest hive rolls of fondant between the bars. First time I've tried this. Rolled like plastercine and pushed down between the bars so crownboard went back on with no gap.

Felt like a beekeeper again!

Remembered hiving one of these colonies on May 1st last year - it was 8 centigrade then and warmer than that today!!

Could you let us know what drop you get as a result of the Oxalic Acid treatment - the Natural Varroa Drop (without treatment) is under suspicion by many as being inaccurate. so I'd be interested if this is born out by your experience this winter.

Thanks

CVB

 

[richardbees]

There was <30 mite drop in my hives after Apiguard treatment in Oct/Nov and negligible natural mite drop since then.

With this mild Winter and constant bee activity I imagine most surviving mites will be in sealed brood - so can't see any point in adding more moisture to the colonies by taking the lid off and trickling OA.....

 

[Moggett]

I have treated despite a low drop. In four days the nuc has dropped 14, the others are at an out apiary so I don't know how many have dropped there so far. The nuc had zero drop before Xmas.

I expect some brood but it should be low numbers and oxalic can work for a couple of weeks I'm led to believe. So it should catch some that emerge over that time too. If it was summer with a full box of brood fair enough, but at this time of year the amount of brood should be a fraction of that so I think it's worth doing.

 

[ianorsven]

Could you let us know what drop you get as a result of the Oxalic Acid treatment - the Natural Varroa Drop (without treatment) is under suspicion by many as being inaccurate. so I'd be interested if this is born out by your experience this winter.

Thanks

CVB

Hi CVB

Planning to cycle out to do counts this morning and check all is well 6 days after treatment. Will post results later.

 

[einsteinagogo]

I counted 300+ ish mites, after 7 days of OA, but checked today, two days after turning over the board, and I've found none!

before, there were 3 a day!

 

[mbc]

I expect some brood but it should be low numbers and oxalic can work for a couple of weeks I'm led to believe. So it should catch some that emerge over that time too.

Does it continue to work killing the mites initially exposed to the acid over a number of weeks or does it linger in the hive environment sufficiently to kill newly emerging, previously unexposed mites ?
I suspect the former or its efficacy would be greater when the hives have brood.

 

[Moggett]

Does it continue to work killing the mites initially exposed to the acid over a number of weeks or does it linger in the hive environment sufficiently to kill newly emerging, previously unexposed mites ?
I suspect the former or its efficacy would be greater when the hives have brood.

To be honest I don't know.

Are some mites slightly harder to kill than others and last a few days longer, or is it how fast the bees transfer the solution and remove it from the hive?

Pity Finman's banned - his opinion would be interesting!

 

[mbc]

Pity Finman's banned - his opinion would be interesting!

 

[pargyle]

"Guys have written so much about Oxalic trickling that most of beekeepers should in prison and rest of hives should be dead."

Message from prison ...

 

[ianorsven]

Promised to post varroa drop numbers post OA treatment on 8th Jan. Here they are, pre and post OA treatment:

Hive 1: Jan 3rd, 3 in 12 days; Jan 14th, 240 in 6 days
Hive 2: Jan 3rd, 0 in 12 days; Jan 14th, 28 in 6 days
Hive 3: Jan 3rd, 0 in 12 days; Jan 14th, 55 in 6 days

Expected to see varroa on trays despite low drops prior to treatment but not as many as 240 from Hive 1. This has gone a long way to persuade me that monitoring varroa drops is of limited value. I will not use the beebase calculator to determine when to treat but will continue to monitor and consider any mite drops as being of significance. So pleased I treated. Am I correct in thinking that without treatment Hive 1 may have been well above the recognised "dangerous 1000" by the end April?

(In case anyone is wondering, I used MAQS in August.)

 

[user 6228]

not treating for the 2nd year in a row... we shall see what happens

There is some varroa in the floor detritus but not much. we have had some DWV but onlly seen it in one or two bees across five colonies. Elaine does a visual wing check at inspection time and we look at the dead bees around the hive.

 

[TryingToLetThemBee]

not treating for the 2nd year in a row... we shall see what happens

Not true: as you have said yourself, you are treating with warmth and humidity. I am not being sarcastic. If we all use the same IPM, we'll never establish equilibrium, so I thank you and Elaine.

 

[ianorsven]

....you are treating with warmth and humidity.

To kill varroa mites? Is there evidence to suggest this is effective in controlling infestations?

 

[beeno]

Promised to post varroa drop numbers post OA treatment on 8th Jan. Here they are, pre and post OA treatment:

Hive 1: Jan 3rd, 3 in 12 days; Jan 14th, 240 in 6 days
Hive 2: Jan 3rd, 0 in 12 days; Jan 14th, 28 in 6 days
Hive 3: Jan 3rd, 0 in 12 days; Jan 14th, 55 in 6 days

Expected to see varroa on trays despite low drops prior to treatment but not as many as 240 from Hive 1. This has gone a long way to persuade me that monitoring varroa drops is of limited value. I will not use the beebase calculator to determine when to treat but will continue to monitor and consider any mite drops as being of significance. So pleased I treated. Am I correct in thinking that without treatment Hive 1 may have been well above the recognised "dangerous 1000" by the end April?

(In case anyone is wondering, I used MAQS in August.)

Hi ianorsven,
As Finman and the Fera varroa leaflet says, the varroa load doubles every month! So, yes you are correct on hive 1.

 

[peteinwilts]

I treated mine last Saturday

Cool, 5°C, but the sun was out and there were a few flyers, but still primarily clustered well. I 'was' going to wait for cooler weather, but as there is none on the horizon for this part of the world, and before we know it Spring will be here, and just did it.

I do not count when performing Oxalic Acid treatments in Winter. IMHO, counting in Winter belongs to the serial tappers brigade.

In addition, if you have a high count, does this mean the oxalic is working, or not working and has a naturally heavy count.
Regardless of the count, the question would be 'if' you have a heavy count, what will you do about it? (the time to deal with it is spring!)

As an FYI, I combined to 39 just before Winter and they are currently all fit and well.... no tapping, no stethoscope, no thermal imaging camera... just letting them do what they are expert at doing. (surviving winters without us!)

 

[VEG]

I tap and dont count

 

[peteinwilts]

I tap and dont count

my apologies! maybe tappers and counters should be segregated under different headings!

I am sure counting is more disturbing than tapping regardless