now what

[yeogi75]

I had two top bar hives for three years until my farther died, I had two colony's in each hive you use dummy boards to slowly increase the hive towards the middle, a dream to inspect everything there no shifting boxes to get to the brood, it was a matter of swopping to nationals or top bars to save having lots of different kit, bit of a pain if you have to move them with two colony's in. the wood is the same thickness as national hives.

 

[maddydog]

The heavy lids are great for slamming on heads.....

Back to the OP, how about combining the nuc with the full size hive? They're quite interesting and it's obvious given the chance bees will produce loads of drones. Insulation and draughtiness are a problem.

 

[Heather]

As they were getting very crowded in the Nuc I have trimmed and tied them into National frames and transferred to a National hive.
4 frames brood, stores galore, now more foundation to draw.
But going to use the Nuc again early next year for queen rearing as so easy to slice eggs off to wax join to a frame in a queenless colony, and these bees so well behaved and excellent queen behaviour, they may well find a portion of them back where they came from..

 

[Beefriendly]

Just for the record .. have either of you ever had a Top Bar Hive ? Or is this tripe something you just repeat as 'common knowledge'.

Nope and never intend to. Thank you for telling me I am talking tripe...most confrontational....The clue for top bar hives is perhaps in the original names...Kenyan top bar hive, Tanzanian top bar hive.
As you've already alluded to, without extra insulation, they were not designed for a UK climate.

Tripe BTW is a much maligned dish...best eaten cold.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Prior to winter you move the brood frames and the nest to one end of the hive (it normally is in the centre with frames of stores either side) and you put the food frames in front of them so they move their way through them so they don't end up at one end of the hive with the stores at the other. You can make a simple frame feeder if they get short of stores and feed them fondant.

It's only in the centre because people in the UK insist on putting the entrance in the middle of the long side of the hive (Maybe the obsession with hobbyists for minimising the harvest) African top bar hives (whether the trough shaped Kenyans or square sided Tanzanians) generally have entrances to one side meaning all the fodd stores are at the 'back' of the hive

 

[viridens]

Nope and never intend to. Thank you for telling me I am talking tripe...most confrontational....The clue for top bar hives is perhaps in the original names...Kenyan top bar hive, Tanzanian top bar hive.
As you've already alluded to, without extra insulation, they were not designed for a UK climate.

Tripe BTW is a much maligned dish...best eaten cold.

I seem to remember that the Kenyan hive was actually developed and trialed in Canada, and that the intention for long hives was to have a hive that could be easily constructed with a few planks, nails and village tools rather than to create some special hive to suit just an African climate. As with any other wooden hive, the insulation mainly depends on the thickness of these wooden parts. -Unless you know better?

 

[pargyle]

Nope and never intend to. Thank you for telling me I am talking tripe...most confrontational....The clue for top bar hives is perhaps in the original names...Kenyan top bar hive, Tanzanian top bar hive.
As you've already alluded to, without extra insulation, they were not designed for a UK climate.

Tripe BTW is a much maligned dish...best eaten cold.

Good Yorkshire expression ... not intended to be confrontational .. just describes information that is not based on fact or is erroneous. The names are irrelevant .. they are derived from where they were used. If you delve a little further into the black art of frameless beekeeping you will find that Top bar beekeeping has been in evidence in many countries - and for long before Langstroth came along.

The original African TBH was developed in Canada and intended as part of a development beekeeping project in Kenya. It was derived from the natural shape of a comb (this shape also led to the catenary hive developed by Bill Bielby about the same time) and three feet was the standard crate size .. They were looking for a hive that could be made simply from materials that were available in country and importantly - that worked for the bees and for the potential beekeepers (who prior to that had used Log Hives of various flavours all of which required the comb to be completely destroyed in order to get to the honey stored. Top bars were simple and allowed just the combs with stores to be removed for the honey.

It was extensively tested in Canada before being introduced to Kenya in the early 1970's. It was intended to be hung from a tree.

The Top bar hives used in the UK, whilst based on the same principles, are very different insomuch as they have a roof (African TBH just have the bars as the roof and perhaps a corrugated sheet over the top). Tend to be made from thicker timber and can even have mesh floors. A very different animal to the original African TBH .. and they do work well for bees.

You should try one .. fascinating to see them comb building - nothing to hate as long as you make them draught proof and insulate.

 

[Beefriendly]

If you go even further back in time you will find the Greeks used a top bar system over an urn and were able to remove the combs.
G. Ntenga is the guy who researched the top bar hive for the Tanzanian government.
I'm afraid as a beekeeping systems go they don't "float my boat", so will leave them for those who do.

 

[Poly Hive]

Cough: Stewerton Hive anyone?

I met in with a chap this year at a garden centre and I had to walk away as the pure rubbish he was imparting to his little group was well rubbish. It's not the mechanism of the long hives that annoys me its the claptrap that goes with it.

I actually own over 20 top bar units which I use for queen mating. They are Warnholz units out of Germany and must be at least 40 years old. The sides slope from top to bottom. Just taking the dogs so will post some pics later.

External dimensions are 195mm wide, 255 long and internal depth is 100mm. They normally are fitted with 4 bars but can take 6.

PH

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

sound just like Kieler mating nucs

 

[Poly Hive]

These ones.

PH

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

yep, almost identical to Kielers - although Kielers have a drop in feeder bowl that when removed gives space for two more bars

 

[Poly Hive]

The plywood food partition just pulls out and another two bars can be added. Really great little units. Can do 4 in a season up here if lucky with the weather.

PH