My cheapskate hive monitor

[pargyle]

I finished my two new polycarbonate crown boards tonight .. both have feeder holes with lids to close the holes off but one of them I've modified and it will take the two sensors ... one is for current and maximum and minimum temperature and the other records current and maximum and minimum humidity. These monitors will give some idea of the conditions inside the hive. Another sensor is available to monitor the external air temperature (and its maximum and minimum).

The chamber the sensors are in is just a turned piece of pine with a mesh screen at the bottom above the frames and a rubber bung allows the cables to pass through and seal any gaps. I'm working on the assumption that heat rises so the temperature sensor should pick up the heat from the colony ..without any draughts out of the top of the hive.

On top of the crown boards will be my 50mm Kingspan insulation and on top of that another layer of insulation over the top of the rapid feeder and the sensor chamber.

So ... what's it going to tell me ... basically whether my well insulated hive is going to allow the colony to maintain a temperature over the winter and what that temperature is going to average out at. Comparing, on a daily basis, any relationship between the temperature inside the hive and the external air temperature.

I've got a secondary plan for some small 12v heater pads that will heat the hive from below the open mesh floor if temperatures fall below a sustainable level for the colony (I don't know what that may be but warming the hive could also aid spring build up).

The actual monoitoring unit is going to be mounted in a clear clip seal box mounted on the outside of the hive for observation without disturbing the bees.

I know it's not in DerekM's league but it will give me some idea of what is going on and keep me off the streets !!

I'm hoping to put the new crown boards on the hive in the morning and check the state of the stores in there at the same time .. then decide whether I need to feed or not.

Total cost £12 for the two new crown boards (just 6mm polycarbonate sheets I cut to size and glued 6mm strips of around the edges to form the beespace) and £12.95 on ebay for the monitoring device. I've also got a manual max and min thermometer which will provide another check for the external temperatures.

 

[Gilberdyke John]

Sounds like an interesting project. I would think about a bead type temperature sensor and perhaps project it into the bee space a mm or more.
Next project load cells under the hive?

 

[alanf]

Sounds like an interesting bit of kit, do you have the ebay reference?

 

[Polyanwood]

What fun. I have always wanted to try underfloor heating. What power source will you use?

 

[drstitson]

in the past i've used the small temp/humidity monitors designed for vivaria - cost under £20 on ebay.

 

[madasafish]

in the past i've used the small temp/humidity monitors designed for vivaria - cost under £20 on ebay.

That is what I have: used for quail rearing..

 

[pargyle]

Sounds like an interesting bit of kit, do you have the ebay reference?

What fun. I have always wanted to try underfloor heating. What power source will you use?

in the past i've used the small temp/humidity monitors designed for vivaria - cost under £20 on ebay.

The monitor unit works off 1.5 v AA battery .. it's gone up a bit in price but still not excessive:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/LCD-Digit...rs_Insects&hash=item5d2ee678ea#ht_2744wt_1160

The heating pads I am thinking of using are these, also on ebay, and they willl run off a 12v car battery (I have a spare one in the garage) but I will need to rig up a temperature sensor and switch mechanism so that they only switch on when the temp in the hive falls to a low level ... I'm thinking that I may put the sensor for these heat pads in the bottom of the hive just below the mesh floor and have the heat pads there as well. If I set the sensor to, say, only cut in when the temp in the bottom of the hive reaches freezing point then the small amount of heat they will generate should just be enough to assist the colony ... I don't want them warmed ... just able to maintain their chosed colony temperature with the least expenditure of energy.

These are the heat pads which are designed for warming motorcycle handlebars (Never had such comforts in my day ... mum used to knit wooly gloves that froze to the bars on frosty mornings when the condensation soaked through !!)

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Motorcycl...cycle_Parts&hash=item565a54c59b#ht_3488wt_923

Can't go wrong at under £4 !!!

 

[alanf]

...The heating pads I am thinking of using are these, also on ebay, and they willl run off a 12v car battery (I have a spare one in the garage) but I will need to rig up a temperature sensor and switch mechanism so that they only switch on when the temp in the hive falls to a low level ...

Thanks for info. I guess they need reading and resetting every day if you're going to plot over time.

I'm sure I've seen thermostatic controls which sound like the sort of thing you would need to switch a pad on, can't say I've got one to play with though. The problem with all these handy devices is that automating an interface with them is the tricky part so something that has a switch built in might be the easier route even if it duplicates sensors.

As it is, I'm thinking along the lines of something that records data over time. Professional sensors, load cells and data loggers are available of course but you're probably into 4 figures to construct something suitable out of industrial components. If cheap sensors (for vivarium temperature, bathroom scales etc) are available something that could monitor them at minimal cost would be the next step.

 

[joe9052]

I have been using a raspberry pi to develop my own hive monitor. At the moment its very early on, the parts work work on their own, need to write program to enable everything to work together.
I am using a load sensor, and a number of temperature sensors, a barometer is also thrown in. the raspberry pi saves all this data to an sd card, or (as currently still working on) my website/internet with a wifi link. I will be working on a 3g link soon.
I have designs to enable a useful battery life, but I need more time to finish it off...!!!

 

[user 6228]

I have been using a raspberry pi to develop my own hive monitor. At the moment its very early on, the parts work work on their own, need to write program to enable everything to work together.
I am using a load sensor, and a number of temperature sensors, a barometer is also thrown in. the raspberry pi saves all this data to an sd card, or (as currently still working on) my website/internet with a wifi link. I will be working on a 3g link soon.
I have designs to enable a useful battery life, but I need more time to finish it off...!!!

which load sensor?

 

[pargyle]

Looks like I'm not alone then ... with some very sophisticated 'competition' by the sounds of it ... but will be very interested to hear how they all go.

I got into my hive this evening ... they are always well behaved so, even though it was after 6.00pm., I wasn't too worried.

Went through all the frames and pleased to say that there are a lot more stores going in after the last inspection on 25th August when there was a definite dearth of stores ... still loads of capped brood in there though. I'm holding off feeding for a week or two as the ivy is just about out down here and I'll see how they go ... looks like they are filling the brood cells as they hatch and clean ... not many eggs or larva although I saw HM so all OK.

Anyway ... here it is ... I'm going to try and track the temp and humidity at least daily ... probably morning and evening ... I'll see how it goes.

 

[user 6228]

if you have a cavity in the roof, how do you stop thermal bridging through the roof cavity?

 

[pargyle]

if you have a cavity in the roof, how do you stop thermal bridging through the roof cavity?

30mm timber outer skin with 10mm polystrene between the outside of the timber and the roofing felt. On the inside of the roof timber is 30mm polystyrene with a 5mm plywood skin inside of that, all sealed at the edges with acrylic sealant and all timber glued and screwed.

On top of the crown boards will be, mostly, 100mm of Kingspan and the edges of the roof seal down onto compression tape on top of the hive walls. You could feel the warmth of the hive when the roof is lifted so I'm hopeful that there won't be any air movement within the roof space or escaping to the outside.

I've got an offer of a thermal image of the hive when it gets a bit colder and that may tell me more about the heat loss. It will certainly be interesting.

 

[mbc]

Looks good.
Every good experiment does need a control though.
(you wouldnt believe how long h I've been waiting to say that)

 

[pargyle]

Looks good.
Every good experiment does need a control though.
(you wouldnt believe how long h I've been waiting to say that)

.... very good ! I was waiting for the obvious response and you have come good ....

Actually, it's not really an experiment ... more just observations at this stage to satisfy my curiosity. I've got the first few days measurements already and they are telling me that the colony is managing to maintain a temperature that is always at least more than 5 degrees above the temperature outside the hive ... but not often much more than 5 degrees.

The humidity fluctuates between about 85% (in the morning) to about 71% in the afternoon ... which is largely what I would expect at present as there is a lot of uncapped honey in the hive and I rather assume that they will be fanning it more overnight. I was a bit surprised at how high the humidity is ... the highest humidity I'd seen outside the hive was just over 60%.

Whilst it would be interesting to see how my hive performs against a standard 14 x 12 I think I'll leave that to those who have more scientific ability and an academic interest in the differences.

My next hive will be the same shape and size but, because of the weight, the next one will be constructed from 50mm Kingspan sandwiched between 5mm plywood on the inside and 5mm recycled plastic sheeting on the outside. Same mesh floor and drawer and apex roof but again with kingspan sandwich construction.

But that's a winter project ... watch this space !!

 

[pargyle]

Today I found this on ebay ... with a bit of luck it will provide me with a cheap controller for my proposed heat pads ... 12 volt so it will run off a car battery and it even looks like it is possible to set it for a range of temperatures:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/380706189510?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1497.l2649

Also I found these ... at this price I can fit another couple of digital sensors ... one to measure the outside temperature and one to measure the temperature at the bottom of the hive as well as the top. The mechanical external thermometer I have at present is not very accurate so that will go in the bin !

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/111127061685?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1497.l2649