Moving cluster vs stationary brood nest

[beeno]

Hi all,
It would seem to me, that you never get two seasons the same when it comes to beekeeping. This is my second year overwintering my colonies and a total opposite to last year. Last year no stores to speak of left in hives come Christmas, but lots of bees as far as I can remember. This year lots of stores, but fewer bees and us beeks cannot do anything about that. Neither can we judge the size of the colony by the activity at the entrance.

Last year I could follow the movement of the cluster as the bees chomped their way through the stores. This year I can only do so on the poly hive, the other three seems to be stuck at the front of the hive not moving. So, my question is are they moving the stores as they dilute the 'honey' into the brood nest area because of the warm weather rather than moving the cluster? If they then take the stores closest to the brood nest then their stores will be further and further away from them. Add brood into the mix, which they will not leave, and a cold spell and the bees have set themselves up for isolation starvation????

 

[Excession]

They know what they are doing.

Your job was to feed before winter.

Chill.

 

[beeno]

They know what they are doing.

Your job was to feed before winter.

Chill.

Are you saying that isolation starvation does not exist?

 

[MartinL]

They know what they are doing.

Your job was to feed before winter.

Chill.

CHILL is exactly what's going on!!!

How does Beeno know what they're upto inside the hive??

 

[beeno]

Martin, do you mind expanding on your comments - me no understandie!

 

[MartinL]

I do my best to avoid opening (and the consequent cooling of) the hive.

Sometimes lift the roof take a sniff of the inside to confirm all is well.

Otherwise nothing more than check the entrance and heft for stores.

If it's going to get really cold, I'll insulate, of if snow threatens I lean a large board against the front of the hive.
That's all they don't want me or anyone else opening the hive, poking around and dispersing their heat!

 

[Luminos]

A bit of conclusion-jumping-to here?
I should think perhaps Beeno is looking at the detritus on a varroa tray to determine where the cluster is, not opening the hives.

 

[Erichalfbee]

Do you have see through crown boards, Beeno?
If you do and there is a prolonged cold spell and the bees can't move take a torch and look at the store frame next to the cluster. If it is empty swap it for a full one from the side of the box. 30 seconds in and out.

 

[Finman]

So, my question is are they moving the stores as they dilute the 'honey' into the brood nest area because of the warm weather rather than moving the cluster? ????

This time of year they do not dilute and they do not move stores.

Add brood into the mix, which they will not leave, and a cold spell and the bees have set themselves up for isolation starvation????

How do you know that they have brood?

Brood rearing consumes so much food that question is not about "isolation".

If you see that food stores are in different part of hive than bees, them move food in the middle of bees. Capped full frames in the middle.

Keep ventilation proper.

.

 

[beeno]

I do my best to avoid opening (and the consequent cooling of) the hive.

Sometimes lift the roof take a sniff of the inside to confirm all is well.

Otherwise nothing more than check the entrance and heft for stores.

If it's going to get really cold, I'll insulate, of if snow threatens I lean a large board against the front of the hive.
That's all they don't want me or anyone else opening the hive, poking around and dispersing their heat!

Wrong thread!

 

[beeno]

A bit of conclusion-jumping-to here?
I should think perhaps Beeno is looking at the detritus on a varroa tray to determine where the cluster is, not opening the hives.

Hi Luminos,
Thank you for that, you obviously had a nice Christmas too.

 

[beeno]

Do you have see through crown boards, Beeno?
If you do and there is a prolonged cold spell and the bees can't move take a torch and look at the store frame next to the cluster. If it is empty swap it for a full one from the side of the box. 30 seconds in and out.

Hi Ericha,
Thanks Ericha - only on one hive and that is not the one I am concerned about!

 

[beeno]

This time of year they do not dilute and they do not move stores.



How do you know that they have brood?

Brood rearing consumes so much food that question is not about "isolation".

If you see that food stores are in different part of hive than bees, them move food in the middle of bees. Capped full frames in the middle.

Keep ventilation proper.

.

Hi Finman,
You have to bear in mind that we have had an extremely mild winter with warm nights in my part of the world. My polyhive is strong and I pulled one brood frame to see if they had brood when doing OA treatment on a day when temp was +10C here. This frame had small honey arc and was full of diluted 'honey' as in preparation for brood rearing but no brood. This hive I did not treat in August as I was waiting for supercedure queen to start laying. Varroa drop day (1) 315, (2) 63, (3,4) 10 took tray out thereafter as it was soaking.
Based on my polyhive I am making the assumption that all my other hives have no brood; as none of my hives are coming back with pollen although they fly off to forage, plus they had very little or no pollen stored.
Thanks for licencing me to move stores frames into broodnest which I may consider prior to a cold snap.

 

[user 6228]

That they move sideways in search of stores at all is quite remarkable considering the bees origins in very tall very narrow cavities. And something else that is remarkable is that they start brood in January/feb in the U.K. when the day length and temperature are so useless to tell the time of year.

 

[Finman]

Hi Finman,
You have to bear in mind that we have had an extremely mild winter with warm nights in my part of the world. .

It is same here. I have here 2-6C plus temps.

This continues 2 weeks more and then the winter is any more very long.
Colonies stand this winter easily. But nosema or varroa do not give mercy.

.

 

[Roola]

I have see through crown boards, I have a couple of peeks whilst hefting this winter and both colonies have remained fairly central in the hive with plenty of frames as yet untouched. Had a peak through mouse guard and they seem actively enough inside too.