Maqs - bad news

[magor]

No..that won't happen with any of the sublimators commercially available... under pressure and under laboratory conditions it is reaction that can occur but not in they way we sublimate OA as beekeepers. Nothing to worry about there...

dunno nothing about those sublimators and the mechanic behind of how simple or complictaed way them work and how them keep heat temps between 157 - 180 C or and how external temps and humidity can play a role or not or how fast them reach that heat cause what ve read is that if oxalic heated more than 180 Celsious or when it heated ''quickly''?(atmospheric pressure?) then part of it transform in formic and others

here in greece ve heard many beekeepers experiment with heat vaping more than 180 C (230-250 C) but dunno the results and how much of oxalic tranform into formic how much into CO2 and if also transform and into carbon monoxide which is toxic

ve used in past when needed dribble oxalic but didnt like both varroa drops and bees condition after and am aware that vaping is more friendly to bees but not to beekeeper(gloves/masc/glasses/change clothes/boots) so my choice is avoid it , i want to have a backup plan as am free treat mostly and cause i ve been left only with apiguard and that under specific external conditions(temps / humidity ) so i would like to know and experiment with formic in future and thats why am trying find any info/research if in oxalic vaping formic also appears and if so which does the job and jep i read here many have problems with maqs or pro but you know acids are sensitive to many factors when applied and many do no follow the apply orders or overdose or and treat small/nuc hives so am not convinced that formic is bad

 

[lizzie-drippin]

So, just to be clear. At this time of year vapourising OA is an acceptable treatment, it doesn’t need to be MAQS/Formic Acid?

Just a treatment of some kind, going into Autumn?

Thanks

 

[Erichalfbee]

Yes. Three maybe four vapes
Days 1, 6,11,16

Just a treatment of some kind, going into Autumn?

Thanks

Not just some kind, though. It has to be effective

 

[Kaz]

[QUOTE

if you follow the instructions and experience an issues with veterinary medicines they can be reported here.
https://www.vmd.defra.gov.uk/adversereactionreporting/report-type
[/QUOTE]

if you follow the instructions and experience an issues with veterinary medicines they can be reported here.
https://www.vmd.defra.gov.uk/adversereactionreporting/report-type

This was so helpful, thank you. I lost 3 queens (out of 13 colonies treated) and have "yellow carded" it using this link. Won't be using it again

 

[lizzie-drippin]

Yes. Three maybe four vapes
Days 1, 6,11,16

Not just some kind, though. It has to be effective

Thanks for this. If I want to leave a super on, do I need to double the amount of OA that I vapourise?

 

[Erichalfbee]

I don't.

 

[user 20297]

Thanks for this. If I want to leave a super on, do I need to double the amount of OA that I vapourise?

Defra guidance dated 2nd August 2021 says that "You should administer the treatment without supers."
It also says that, "Significantly higher bee mortality was observed in hives that received double dosages of the product."
EDIT: I've not seen the previous to this; the DEFRA guidance applies when honey honey supers are present, but maybe you're talking about broood and a half?

 

[Erichalfbee]

Thanks for this. If I want to leave a super on, do I need to double the amount of OA that I vapourise?

If you are talking about a super of honey you are leaving on fir the bees but plan to use as a honey super next year you take the super off, vape and put the super back.

 

[lizzie-drippin]

If you are talking about a super of honey you are leaving on fir the bees but plan to use as a honey super next year you take the super off, vape and put the super back.

It is a super we leave on over winter for the bees. Not a super we harvest the honey from.

 

[Erichalfbee]

It is a super we leave on over winter for the bees. Not a super we harvest the honey from.

Brood and a half then.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

2.5g of OA is still sufficient

 

[lizzie-drippin]

Brood and a half then.

It also means I don’t need to mess around out a crown board between the brood box and super to get all the bees down..

 

[Jules59]

I used MAQS, as directed, on two very similar adjacent colonies. Each had double brood with 3 or 4 supers. After the 7 day treatment period one colony had just carried on as if nothing had happened, but the other was now queenless, with lots of dead brood (dead emerging bees with their sticking out of the cells) and 15 or so sealed queen cells. Strange how the colonies reacted so differently. I wonder if the sealed QC larvae are still viable ? Time will tell.
Maybe its a quality control problem with the product?

 

[Ringlander]

I have just used MAQS on six of my 14x12 colonies, the second time I've used it. The first time, a couple of years ago, the stuff stank to high heaven and made my eyes water when putting it in the hives, lots of bees came out onto the landing board even through the nights and although I had no queen deaths they all went off lay for nearly a month, long after the remains of the MAQS strips were removed. I did however see a massive varroa drop during treatment and a reduction to something like 5% of the pre-treatment natural 24hour drop so was happy it had worked. The bees seemed to dislike it so much however that I decided to go over to OA vaping.

A badly timed holiday this year left me with little choice but to use MAQS again so I did. This time the stuff didn't smell half as strong, the bees appeared to take no notice of it at all and although there was a 3-4 times increase in 24 hour varroa drop during treatment the post treatment drops seem similar to the pre-treatment, so I am concered it hasn't worked. Unlike last time the strips have not completely disinegrated but a large part of the carrier gel remains, although it is now rock hard. Has it been re-formulated or should I suspect a bad batch? Have other users had similar results?