How many cells could I raise?

[Swarm]

Very interesting topic.
I have only 5 colonies, hoping to have 10 by year end and try to get some honey.
I was thinking of using a nuc as a cell builder
Getting the cells draw above a q right colony using an almost closed off q excluder, ram the nuc full of nurse bees and hope for the best.
Hoping to raise maybe 10 queens.
It might work?

You could get at least ten easily by using a Demarree method.

 

[KJB]

Good to hear.
I still need to do much more research on queen rearing but I am enjoying the learning

 

[KJB]

Thanks for the replies.
I must look into the cloak board.
Appreciate the response from you more experienced beekeepers.
On the volume of honey from 5 hives, if I get 20 lbs I will be happy. Mind you I wouldn't say no to 200 lbs!!!

 

[jeff33]

merge the three nucs, as much brood and bees as you can into the one box...( Check frames for qcs and break down after 3 days)

You mix in open and capped brood in the nuc? I always thought stick to capped brood to avoid rogue cells and ensure graft take-up. I have used open brood in a nuc previously to prime the nurse bees for feeding but removed it b4 when the graft went in.

 

[elainemary]

I make a cell builder by adding brood to a strong colony, above an excluder, to boost the colony to swarming strength. 10 days later I separate the colony using the box above the excluder as the cell builder. This box needs to be checked for emergency cells before adding the graft. Over the years, I found 1/4-1/3 will start emergency cells. No more. Seems risky to use this NBU method

I tried the NBU method last year just once though, didn’t work. Did struggle to see why it would work as well with a queen below in the bottom box but tried it. Just confirmed my suspicions. I’ll be trying Cloake board this season instead, makes more sense - create conditions where bees make emergency cells, then switch to supercedure conditions so the larvae get well fed; make sure the colony is strong with lots of nurse bees in the top box first. Logical.

 

[jeff33]

I tried the NBU method last year just once though, didn’t work. Did struggle to see why it would work as well with a queen below in the bottom box but tried it. Just confirmed my suspicions. I’ll be trying Cloake board this season instead, makes more sense - create conditions where bees make emergency cells, then switch to supercedure conditions so the larvae get well fed; make sure the colony is strong with lots of nurse bees in the top box first. Logical.

It works really well. I do a mix of Mike's method (add frames of capped brood 10 days before) and switch to cloake Board 24h before grafting. I shake a lot of the bees from the bottom box in the top as well (making sure I don't put the queen in there). Be careful though when you have such a strong hive and the cells are removed they will likely swarm so you may need to split or make a couple of nucs to ease congestion.

 

[elainemary]

It works really well. I do a mix of Mike's method (add frames of capped brood 10 days before) and switch to cloake Board 24h before grafting. I shake a lot of the bees from the bottom box in the top as well (making sure I don't put the queen in there). Be careful though when you have such a strong hive and the cells are removed they will likely swarm so you may need to split or make a couple of nucs to ease congestion.

Thanks, good tips. I don’t need a large number of queens, just enough to requeen a couple of colonies, have a few in reserve for unforeseen situations and to overwinter a small number of Nucs. Oh and a few more in case of poor mating. Maybe I do need more than I think!

 

[jeff33]

Thanks, good tips. I don’t need a large number of queens, just enough to requeen a couple of colonies, have a few in reserve for unforeseen situations and to overwinter a small number of Nucs. Oh and a few more in case of poor mating. Maybe I do need more than I think!

Based on my experience, 12 grafts will give me 4 mated queens. I only have 12 cells on my bar as I don't have the resources to deal with more than 8 virgins at any one time. I tend to do a 1st round mid-May and a 2nd towards the early July. I am asking too much from my 10 hives at this apiary as I also want a crop if possible.
This year I am re-thinking my set-up, I have 2 other apiaries with only production hives (6 in each) and the mating apiary will be solely for this and making nucs.

 

[mbc]

You mix in open and capped brood in the nuc? I always thought stick to capped brood to avoid rogue cells and ensure graft take-up. I have used open brood in a nuc previously to prime the nurse bees for feeding but removed it b4 when the graft went in.

Likewise Jeff, I like to leave brood frames over an excluder for ten days to let all the eggs hatch and larvae capped over, you get a better take as the bees are really desperate after a few hours with nothing open to work with.
Credit goes to Michael Palmer and his excellent "queen rearing in the sustainable apiary" presentation, he was also good enough to answer questions on here, convinced me against finishing cells with open brood a la traditional Cloak board method but to leave them to get sealed(5days) before reintroduction with the brood and queen below qx.

 

[Michael Palmer]

It works really well. I do a mix of Mike's method (add frames of capped brood 10 days before) and switch to cloake Board 24h before grafting. I shake a lot of the bees from the bottom box in the top as well (making sure I don't put the queen in there). Be careful though when you have such a strong hive and the cells are removed they will likely swarm so you may need to split or make a couple of nucs to ease congestion.

Something I began experimenting with...The day I harvest the cells from the box above the excluder. After harvesting the cells, the box goes on a new bottom and is moved to the mating apiary. Given a cell, a new colony is started. So the brood harvested from the brood factories has a second use. First used to grow the queen cells, and then the remainder above the excluder becomes a new colony.

 

[elainemary]

Based on my experience, 12 grafts will give me 4 mated queens. I only have 12 cells on my bar as I don't have the resources to deal with more than 8 virgins at any one time. I tend to do a 1st round mid-May and a 2nd towards the early July. I am asking too much from my 10 hives at this apiary as I also want a crop if possible.
This year I am re-thinking my set-up, I have 2 other apiaries with only production hives (6 in each) and the mating apiary will be solely for this and making nucs.

That's what I'm trying to do - get the best genetics from my selected colonies into one apiary, so queen raising (up to the point of virgin queens) takes place here. However, I then take my 'best' virgin queens to a separate apiary where mating is always v good and seems to consistently produce dark queens, which I prefer for various reasons. My mating apiary has poorer access and less space than my other out-apiary, but easy to move Nucs to & from, for mating. Agree best to have 2 rounds of raising and keep numbers to manageable amounts, so the bees can still produce honey and the whole experience is enjoyable.

 

[domino]

Thanks for the replies, I think I'll give the cloak board a whirl. Still means all my hives stay queen right and hopefully I'll get some nice queens.