hive insulation and ventilation

[itma]

If your hive needed top insulation it would have come supplied with it.

Some comments seem, by their apparent foolishness, to be designed to provoke a correction.

I've not bought a hive with bees, mouseguard, inspection tray, feeder, etc.
Or insulation.

Perhaps you might care to and reconsider your comment?

I think that might be more constructive than criticising the people responding to your rather strange posting.

 

[drstitson]

"Solid floor with top ventilation or open mesh floor is a choice, at least from my supplier."

do they throw in a luxury home for free too????


Most people BUY bits for hives that they can't or won't make themselves and are willing to pay for the privilege.

a piece of kingspan will cost just a couple of quid (or be free from a skip). No market.

 

[drstitson]

"I've not bought a hive with bees, mouseguard, inspection tray, feeder, etc.
Or insulation."



beat me to it.


However some retailers do throw in EFB as part of the deal!!!!

 

[Spomenko]

Hundred people, a hundred and one character, at least.
I read what you wrote and I do not believe.
You are all right, but just for your yard.
Let it remain, and will not have problems with beekeeping.

 

[drstitson]

Do i sense the emergence of a Balkan Finman????

 

[huntsman666]

Funny how those who don't use top insulation are still happy to overwinter their bees without it.

One would imagine if there was a problem getting them through the winter they would all have changed over to using insulation. Point is they haven't.

Perhaps we have a lot of modern beekeepers who also buy winter jackets for their dogs and like to treat their bees in a similar manner.

Anyway, each to their own.

 

[user 6228]

Funny how those who don't use top insulation are still happy to overwinter their bees without it.

One would imagine if there was a problem getting them through the winter they would all have changed over to using insulation. Point is they haven't.

Perhaps we have a lot of modern beekeepers who also buy winter jackets for their dogs and like to treat their bees in a similar manner.

Anyway, each to their own.

[parody]...Funny how lot of men still beat their wives and the wives have mostly survived,
One would imagine if there was a problem getting them to suvive a good kicking they would all have changed over to kindness, the point is they would have all change over to not beating and they havent. Perhaps men who dont beat their dogs will like treat their wives in a similar manner
Anyway, each to their own
...[/parody]

 

[user 6228]

Ventilation --- the answer is 1 Litre per minute for a 5 month winter with bees consuming 12Kg sugar equivalent. if you can do this its less than 10% of the energy wasted

Seems like a very small hole indeed...

but thats only if you let the bees warm up the top of the hive to 34C

 

[Luminos]

As a newbee going into my first winter, can I ask the question: could I actually cause harm to the bees by adding insulation, assuming I were to do so?

 

[Monsieur Abeille]

As a newbee going into my first winter, can I ask the question: could I actually cause harm to the bees by adding insulation, assuming I were to do so?

(Assuming OMF and no top ventilation) Top insulation without side insulation no problem. Any condensation generated should go down the sides as they are cooler. If the four sides are insulated as well though I believe there is a concern that condensation will drip from the crown board in the middle of the hive, not good for huddling bees - mind you I don't know how this is dealt with in poly hives so perhaps I'm talking rubbish (wont be the first time!)

 

[tonybloke]

Some comments seem, by their apparent foolishness, to be designed to provoke a correction.

I've not bought a hive with bees, mouseguard, inspection tray, feeder, etc.
Or insulation.

Perhaps you might care to and reconsider your comment?

I think that might be more constructive than criticising the people responding to your rather strange posting.

 

[Luminos]

(Assuming OMF and no top ventilation) Top insulation without side insulation no problem. Any condensation generated should go down the sides as they are cooler. If the four sides are insulated as well though I believe there is a concern that condensation will drip from the crown board in the middle of the hive, not good for huddling bees - mind you I don't know how this is dealt with in poly hives so perhaps I'm talking rubbish (wont be the first time!)

Yes, I have OMF and crown board holes covered. It's a WBC so I was hoping the sides would have that extra bit of protection anyway, without insulation.

 

[madasafish]

The debate about insulation is meaningless in isolation (as discussed before)..

What is OK next to the sea in the South of England may not be apposite sited 2,000 feet up a mountain in N England or Scotland...

I find the strongest advocates of no insulation tend to live in the south.. I wonder why?

 

[Monsieur Abeille]

Yes, I have OMF and crown board holes covered. It's a WBC so I was hoping the sides would have that extra bit of protection anyway, without insulation.

Don't know what your winter temps are like but top insulation should do them no harm

 

[user 6228]

As a newbee going into my first winter, can I ask the question: could I actually cause harm to the bees by adding insulation, assuming I were to do so?

yes, you can harm them but it would take a lot of insulation and a very mild winter (winter temp above ectothermic limit of hive)... The theory says you are basically safe dumping into the equivalent of a bought full poly hive(40mm polystyrene national = ectothermic limit around 25C) , given enough room for the bees to spread out a little. If you go above that level of insulaton you need to take care when the temps start to go up.

Hopefully PolyH will give practical assurance.

 

[user 6228]

The debate about insulation is meaningless in isolation (as discussed before)..

What is OK next to the sea in the South of England may not be apposite sited 2,000 feet up a mountain in N England or Scotland...

I find the strongest advocates of no insulation tend to live in the south.. I wonder why?

Haven't always lived down here but the temps and rainfall here is not much different from the Cheshire plain and the Lancashire coast

 

[Finman]

.
What you are going to do now....

Insulated polyhives are popping up in UK like mushrooms in the forest after rain.

What are arguments then when polyhives have better yields?

No, I am kidding. Goog yields depend on pastures.
Polyhives swarm earlier because they have better Spring build up.

There is a huge debate about insulation on Beemaster forum. The reality is that in Alaska they prefer to kill hives in Autumn, because they do not know how to keep hives alive over winter. They have the same hive furniture as in south. Texas is at the level of North Africa.
In some places they give 60 kg winter food to the hive (3 boxes). - That needs insulation to drop it to 20 kg.

americans are deadly afraid of condensation. I wonder why?

I must say that I am not proud about the knowledge of insulation in UK or USA. Awfull to read.

The best comment in Beemaster forum is that mesh floor heats the hive.
I know that in Uk heating energy is expencive. Make mesh floors to your houses!
Free energy! Second best is that one guy wraps only the north side of hive because cold comes from north.

More over... The locally adapted bees are the most important fartor in wintering. In the same hive Anatolian bee in Finland consumes 80 kg honey in a winter. italian consumes 20-30 kg. New Zealand bees will die here.

In USA they try to rear same stock everywhere. Bees from Hawaiji and from Australia.
They do not even talk about that.

 

[Into the lions den]

Not rubbish. The hand hold areas is the answer. this is the thin point and the spot where most of the condensation forms, runs down the sides if there is a lot and out the OMF.

 

[Nic Rhodes]

looks like our association will be doing thermal imaging this winter on some hive types with and without insulation, should be fun. Perhaps if the results are interesting, we will monitor a hive in more detail next year.

 

[drstitson]

"we will monitor a hive in more detail next year."

you can get cheap digital temp/humidity meters for vivariums on fleabay (under £15-20). probe goes in hive above the cluster; meter under roof.