High varroa count post-treatment

[boywonder]

Hi all,

With most of my bees I have been 'on it' this year, with Formic Pro (and formic acid delivered via a Nassenheider Professional) being administered late August - having moved to formic as my autumn 'treatment of choice' from thymol (either Apiguard or Apilife VAR). No worries there.

However, I have a couple of colonies at another location where I had taken my eye off the ball, and where I chose instead - and during September, so fairly late - to use some remaining stocks of Apilife VAR (still in date, just).

Mite drops were high, so I was presuming the treatment to have been effective. However, something has been niggling me; probably a combination of the dodgy September weather, the impending expiry of the product, but also due to a drop off in the activity at the entrance of one of the two hives.

So I went in yesterday, and did a quick alcohol wash.

In going into the brood nest to do this, I noted that both seemed to be lacking in open brood. That said, both were Q+ at last inspection. Good young Queens, too, so I have little worry there. I am presuming both the time of year and the thymol treatment have resulted in them going off lay.

Anyway, the results of the alcohol wash showed an 11% and a 13% infestation respectively. Hmmmmmmm.

The crux of my question is:
1) Am I right to be horrified by these numbers?
2) What would people suggest in relation to consequences (if I just cross my fingers), and remedial actions?

I am dead against miticides, so e.g. Apivar is out of the question for me. One option I have is to quickly bang a couple of Formic Pro on (it being just still within the temperature envelope), but feel I might be better served borrowing the Association's Varrox Eddy, and blasting with oxalic - especially given the lack of brood.

Thoughts, please!

 

[The Poot]

The Formic pro might be a step too far…..I’d give them a vape as it’s very effective and less harmful than formic.

 

[robmort]

Just vape with OA, simple and effective.

 

[Parsonage Bees]

The couple of times I've used ApiLife Var I've had to re-treat. The second time I tried it was because it was recommended by an academic in the USA on a YouTube video, so I thought I'd give it another try. I don't think it knocks down enough mites to be effective. (following my sample of 2 x 4 odd hives)

11 and 13% is about the highest rate I've ever seen! I had one a couple of years ago which had been treated the same but somehow generated 13% mites.

Vaping seems to be recommended by many but I've never used it.
Too late for Formic.
OA dribble in early to mid-December. Only 8 weeks away. They are probably tough enough to handle 13% mite level (?) Then maybe treat again with something else before supers go on next year.

Well done for measuring infestation properly. Now you know you can worry about it! There are probably many (me included this year) who are blissfully unaware.
It was a situation like this that pushed me into using Apivar. (sorry)

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

OA dribble in early to mid-December. Only 8 weeks away

and way too late if they have a high mite burden

 

[Parsonage Bees]

and way too late if they have a high mite burden

Already too late for the early winter bees. OAD now? Can't do it again in December. I see the attraction of vaping.
One thought is, "they are dead already", unless you do something.
But is it going to kill the colony. 89-87% NOT carrying a mite? (but viruses, etc. ) They may be weak into next year and need re-treating.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Already too late for the early winter bees

no

 

[Parsonage Bees]

But then I remember this.
I saved this from a research paper. Sorry to the author I've lost the link. I remember they handled thousands of bees repeatably, individually checking for mites. Remarkable determination.

Not sure of the detail but think they found 14.6% infestation but 59.9% of the bees had been bitten.

 

[Parsonage Bees]

no

Too early?

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

many colonies are just coming off a brood break now, so only then will start producing this apocryphal 'winter bee'

 

[pargyle]

many colonies are just coming off a brood break now, so only then will start producing this apocryphal 'winter bee'

When I was swapping out frames two of mine had virtually no capped brood but a frame and a half of eggs and larvae .. I wondered about this situation - but that makes sense.

 

[Parsonage Bees]

There are probably many (me included this year) who are blissfully unaware.

Counted varroa drop over 3 days. 3 colonies - 2-4v/day but . . . . . . 2 colonies - 20v/day (incl. biggest,most productive colony)
Used Apiguard over September - mid-October
Some say drop isn't accurate but it's an indication at least. Not doing a mite wash at this time of year.

Thinking I'll wait and do the usual OAD in early-mid December.

 

[Erichalfbee]

The hive that’s dropping lots I would do now x3

 

[Parsonage Bees]

The hive that’s dropping lots I would do now x3

Too scared (and too cheap) to use OAV.

Used ApiVar on them in April. Could use again but you're supposed to rotate treatments, right?

I can afford to loose them so will test my idea that they are tough enough to survive some neglect.

 

[Penninetrader]

When I was swapping out frames two of mine had virtually no capped brood but a frame and a half of eggs and larvae .. I wondered about this situation - but that makes sense.

When did you swap out those frames ?

 

[pargyle]

When did you swap out those frames ?

End of September when I sfarted feeding them ...

 

[Penninetrader]

End of September when I sfarted feeding them ...

I was just checking you hadn't disturbed those profilis seals

 

[pargyle]

I was just checking you hadn't disturbed those profiles seals

No ... not really been into them properly since the beginning of September and that was just a quick whizz through. The frames I replaced were out with the old dark ones at the back, slide along with the hive tool and in with the new ... 30 seconds frm start to finish.

Had a look through the clear crownboards this afternoon... plenty of bees on the top bars and hives hefting fairly heavy now - gave them all another 2 litres of invert but I think that will be it now. Feeders will be off and my winter slabs of insulation will go on - they have 50mm above the feeders but that will be doubled when the feeders come off.