Hello from a first timer!

[IBeeZac]

Hello all!

Just done my first inspection after installing an over wintered 5 frame nuc 9 days ago.
I saw the queen and brood in all stages when I installed the nuc.
They’ve had a rapid feeder with sugar syrup and pollen patty on top of the crown board for the last 8 days.
The colony seems to have grown significantly which is good news, and they seem friendly and not overly bothered by my amateurish 20 min inspection.
The reason it took so long is that whilst they seem strong, and they’ve drawn comb around their existing frames, they haven’t drawn a single bit of comb on the additional frames in the hive, and whilst I saw plenty of capped brood and good amount of lave I couldn’t see any eggs and I couldn’t see the queen (marked and clipped). I did also see 3-4 queen cells which were uncapped and appeared empty.

Should I be worried? How long should I leave until next inspection? Was thinking a week but don’t want to leave it too long and something go wrong that I could have prevented!

All advice gratefully received!! Thanks!

 

[enrico]

Sounds like there is more than a bee space round the frames. Hence the reason they have built wild comb. I would consider putting them in a proper size box. It isn't too cold in Gloucestershire.
Welcome to the forum. Photos are always good! Good luck

 

[E&MBees]

Might be worth asking someone to have a look with you. Bees will try and swarm with a clipped queen, even though she can’t fly properly.

 

[IBeeZac]

Thanks for the welcome!
They’re in a 10 frame Deep
National with a dummy board. Hofmann self spacing snugly butted up together, so hopefully the have the right amount of space between frames. WBC. No super yet until they draw comb on the new frames. Would have thought that was enough space?

 

[Swarm]

Slip one of the foundations between the outer stores frame and the nest and even consider a small feed of very light syrup, a bit thinner than 1 - 1. They need a good flow to draw wax and the thin syrup will help to energise them.

 

[enrico]

Thanks for the welcome!
They’re in a 10 frame Deep
National with a dummy board. Hofmann self spacing snugly butted up together, so hopefully the have the right amount of space between frames. WBC. No super yet until they draw comb on the new frames. Would have thought that was enough space?

Of course that is enough but from your first post I presumed they were still in the nuc. Not sure what you mean when you say they have drawn comb around the original frame! Please be aware you have seen your bees but we haven't so we have to guess what you mean from what you say! We try to help but we can only work with what you tell us!
Cheers

 

[IBeeZac]

Update….
Inspected again today.
I tried pics, but am unable to use my phone with my gloves on! I’ll be brave next inspection and just go 1-gloved.

Negatives:
Still no comb on the 5 frames of new foundation.
Couldn’t find a queen.
Couldn’t see any eggs
Couldn’t see any lave except what looked like 3 drones in the process of being capped.
Capped Brood feels like it’s less then last time, but could be wrong.

Positives:
They’ve finished 4pints of Dulcofruct in 2 weeks
Feels like a good amount of pollen stores
Lots of bees bringing in plenty of pollen
Colony certainly greater in number - lots more bees flying around during inspection and the 5 frames I bought are full.

No idea if +ve or -ve:
6 what seem to be empty queen cells
On one foundation frame plenty of bees covering it all hanging vertically from each others legs.

Firstly, have I just missed the queen or should I be getting another one? If she’s gone, where has she gone too?!? Haven’t noticed a swarm and don’t think the colony has reduced in size enough to have gad a swarm.

Secondly, it feels like they should be drawing comb into the foundation frames. Are they not drawing because there is no need for more egg laying space or more stores?

Please ask questions and I’ll try and answer them, I might not have included anywhere near enough info or missed something crucial out.

Any advice appreciated!

 

[drex]

You say there is no comb on the new foundation, but then day they are hanging vertically by their legs, which is how they draw comb. So no worry there. They only draw comb as they need it. It is difficult to judge bee numbers by those flying around. Better to count the number of frames covered by bees.
If you have difficulty seeing eggs, then settle for seeing uncapped larvae. Good light and a magnifier can help.
"Queen cells" mean nothing unless they contain jelly or larvae. A picture would help.
Do you have access to a mentor, local association or been on a beginners course?

 

[E&MBees]

Get one of those pens for mobile phones. I have one in my bee box. Invaluable when the bees are attacking your hands and you need advice from your mentor!

 

[IBeeZac]

Little update…

I put a new queen in, left her for 48hrs, removed the tab to allow the bees to eat through slowly and on day 5 found her dead outside the hive!

Obv did have a queen and I’m just useless at spotting her.

3 inspections since then there have been absolutely huge amounts of eggs/larva/capped brood.

I added my first super 1 week ago as they were clearly running out of room and building comb on every single surface - almost every frame was stuck to the varroa mesh floor.

Todays inspection all 8 frames in the new super have been drawn to the extent that 5 of them were stuck firm to the crown board when I took it off! The middle 5 frames were full of nectar tho think this might be because there was still the rapid feeder on top to help them draw comb.

I didn’t get to the brood box today because I didn’t have time without rushing it so will try again in a few days.

Still haven’t seen the actual queen since installing her 2 or so months ago!

Questions:
When should I add a second super?

Should I have 10 frames in the super not 8? They’re currently castellated.

When should I remove the solid floor under the varroa mesh?

When should I remove pollen patty/rapid feeder? They are clearly growing rapidly, and seem v busy but I’m wary of the ‘june gap’

I get the occasional single bee that does not leave me alone at all during inspections. The others seem calm but the 1-(occasionally 2)-bee-vendetta is very off putting. Is this normal, and if so how do I stop it?!?

Thanks again from a newb!

 

[North End Bees]

Obv did have a queen and I’m just useless at spotting her.

Unfortunate, but beginner's mistake. You know now for the future!
You don't have to see the queen each time (or even at all unless you need to for a particular manipulation). Just check for eggs/young larvae.

Questions:
When should I add a second super?

Should I have 10 frames in the super not 8? They’re currently castellated.

Add now and a full complement of frames (10 if 10 castellations).

When should I remove the solid floor under the varroa mesh?

Remove now. The drawer is really just for checking varroa drop after treatment.

When should I remove pollen patty/rapid feeder? They are clearly growing rapidly, and seem v busy but I’m wary of the ‘june gap’

That should have been removed when you put the first super on. Supers are for honey not sugar! They will draw the super foundation if they have nectar to put in it.

They should have enough sugar now to cover any local June gap. But you'll be checking stores at each weekly inspection anyway.

I get the occasional single bee that does not leave me alone at all during inspections. The others seem calm but the 1-(occasionally 2)-bee-vendetta is very off putting. Is this normal, and if so how do I stop it?!?

If they're generally calm, the odd bee is probably just reacting to your handling. Try to be gentler!

 

[IBeeZac]

Thanks so much @Little_bees! Really useful. Should have clarified, I have space for 8 castellated spacers. There are 8 frames in each super. Should I change the castellations to 10 and out 10 frames in each super? if so, what are the benefits? I guess potentially more honey?

Also, in my weekly inspections, can I or should I just lift the whole super off with frames in it? My mind was trying to work out where to put them if I had to take the frames out first!

Thanks again!

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

if you are starting out with foundation in the shallow frames, the most you should space them is ten to a box - any fewer and the bees will just draw brace comb everywhere and leave your supers in a mess.
No benefits to using only eight frames in a super - the difference in yield is minescule, more to the point, thicker comb takes longer to extract and the extra weight can cause issues with balancing the extractor.

 

[North End Bees]

Also, in my weekly inspections, can I or should I just lift the whole super off with frames in it? My mind was trying to work out where to put them if I had to take the frames out first!

Yes just lift off the whole super and put it aside on the upturned roof or a spare stand. Rest the QX by the entrance, not by the supers (in case the Q is on it).