Do i have any chance of saving this?

[Nbw]

So background.

We had a very heathy hive, i missed a QC and we had a huge swarm. We were unable to take back the swarm so went through the process of introducing a mated queen from Black Mountain honey. The queen was rejected by the colony and the bees started producing several QC's. I split the colony with a strong QC each, so i had a Nuc and the Hive. The Nuc split failed. The Hive on inspection today doesnt look good. No brood, no larva, lots of honey filling the brood frames. And not a lot of bees. very very little.

What is the best course of action here?
Any support or suggestions?

Thanks
Nick

 

[enrico]

So background.

We had a very heathy hive, i missed a QC and we had a huge swarm. We were unable to take back the swarm so went through the process of introducing a mated queen from Black Mountain honey. The queen was rejected by the colony and the bees started producing several QC's. I split the colony with a strong QC each, so i had a Nuc and the Hive. The Nuc split failed. The Hive on inspection today doesnt look good. No brood, no larva, lots of honey filling the brood frames. And not a lot of bees. very very little.

What is the best course of action here?
Any support or suggestions?

Thanks
Nick

Need some dates (and I don't mean the bees need eating dates I mean we need some dates to know when what happened)

 

[Nbw]

April 23 we had the swarm
May 10 introduced new mated queen
May 12 released queen
May 26 inspected hive and new mated queen not there
June 9th split the QC between hive and nuc
Left for over a month to let the queen mate and settle
inspected today, nothing

 

[Wilco]

As well as a queen you need young bees to raise the brood. Add some sealed brood if you can. A week later add open brood.

 

[Nbw]

Am i better getting a small Nuc?

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

April 23 we had the swarm
May 10 introduced new mated queen
May 12 released queen
May 26 inspected hive and new mated queen not there
June 9th split the QC between hive and nuc
Left for over a month to let the queen mate and settle
inspected today, nothing

so the bees swarmed and left a QC?
by May 10 there would have been a virgin in there and all the brood from the swarmed queen would have emerged
May 12 virgin and bought in queen met
Where did the brood come from?
How much of it was there?
was there any there before you released the new queen?
How did you release her?

 

[Nbw]

so the bees swarmed and left a QC?

Yes but after speaking with another bee keeper, they suggested removing the QC and buying a mated queen which i did

by May 10 there would have been a virgin in there and all the brood from the swarmed queen would have emerged
May 12 virgin and bought in queen met

There was no queen there

Where did the brood come from?
How much of it was there?

there seemed plenty of brood there

was there any there before you released the new queen?

Yes there was some

How did you release her?

Left the queen caged for 2 days, she seemed to be accepted. Tore off the platic ends and allowed the bees to free the queen

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

I think the other beekeeper was totally wrong in their 'advice'
Bees sat hopelessly queenless for a month will often balk at a new queen.
Looks like they let her start laying then killed her, at this point you would have been better just keeping the colony together and leaving them raise their own new queen. not time for the queen to mate and start laying really but even if she started tomorrow you have seriously depleted their workforce

 

[enrico]

I agree as above. Allow 7 days for capped queen cells to emerge. I still think that either of those hives might have a queen likely to lay soon.
As JBM I would not have split the hive. It is so easy to remove all but one queen cell after a swarm and let them get on with it. That is what they do all the time, by the time you have faffed with a new queen, ruined their chances of raising their own, you are ages behind! If the new queen they raised on their own had been naff then fine, but.....
I understand how difficult it is to make a decision and when someone gives you advice you tend to think that must be the only way to go. No problems with following that advice but what is their advice now?
Hope it works out. I would be patient for two more weeks but......obviously the choice is yours.
Test frames if you have and frames of eggs anywhere?

 

[Nbw]

Thanks both. I expected that to be honest from both of your comments. This is my only hive which is why I thought the advice was the best for my situation. As well as splitting.

Deep breath time.

No test frames or eggs available. The only thing i can think about is to purchase a 6 frame nuc...

 

[E&MBees]

Thanks both. I expected that to be honest from both of your comments. This is my only hive which is why I thought the advice was the best for my situation. As well as splitting.

Deep breath time.

No test frames or eggs available. The only thing i can think about is to purchase a 6 frame nuc...

Do you know someone who may be able to donate a test frame or a small section of comb with eggs for you to try in the hive?

 

[idg]

Where in the country are you?

 

[enrico]

Be patient, I believe in the bees, give them two more weeks ...... But buy a nuc just in case!

 

[blackcloud]

They can surprise as well as disappoint.
Occasionally

So you will be keeping more than one colony in the future?

 

[Nbw]

Where in the country are you?

I am in essex

 

[Nbw]

They can surprise as well as disappoint.
Occasionally

So you will be keeping more than one colony in the future?

No. I think 2 is a safer bet

 

[Nbw]

Be patient, I believe in the bees, give them two more weeks ...... But buy a nuc just in case!

Yep


So question. I buy a nuc. How do I move the nuc into the hive. With the existing bees or wait for the hive to be empty?

 

[blackcloud]

Colonies will fight unless slowly combined,so you will need to have a second hive ready to put the nuc into and keep them separate or just a compatible brood box and unite them through newspaper.
Personally I'd opt for the first option and give the first colony a chance- swap them over if the nuc grows and the hive contracts

 

[enrico]

Yep


So question. I buy a nuc. How do I move the nuc into the hive. With the existing bees or wait for the hive to be empty?

You don't. You are buying it so that if you have no queen's eventually at least you have some bees. You could combine them when you KNOW that the others are queenless but you will require a brood box for the new nuc.

 

[ericbeaumont]

I am in essex

Where in Essex, Nick?