Cup kit tips

[drex]

I have just tried the £25 cup kit system from T's. Put it into an old brood frame , which was clean but well drawn out. Put it in hive for 3 days for bees to clean it up. It was a big colony with queen laying well. After 3 days she had still not laid any eggs. Took it out. Released her. She is laying well again back in the hive. What did I do wrong? Have read about pressing cups into soft wax to get a blob of wax in cup, but most sources talk about using straight out of box.

 

[MJBee]

The Jenter instructions (similar system) say brush the cells with molten bees wax then introduce for 3 days then cage the queen.

The was coating only needs to be done once - worked for me

 

[Stiffy]

I use the Jentor system and when first purchased put some wax as suggested in cups. I wouldn't recommend it as it makes the cups stick and is a buxxer to release after queen has laid.
I now make sure the cups are really clean before using and then leave in hive for a few days for them to further clean, add queen for 24hrs, if she lays then release or leave her there for another 24hrs...no longer.
I have had a queen this year lay up a cupkit when I put into the hive to be cleaned and another that flatly refused to use it.
Have fun
S

 

[Black Comb]

Cells must be super clean if used before. Some recommend new cells only.
A drop of honey in each cell,and frame inserted 2-3 days before queen is confined.
The honey ensures the workers clean out the cell, hopefully queen is more likely to use them.

 

[Little John]

You might want to take a look at: http://www.dave-cushman.net/bee/cellplugbox.html
where it's suggested to first make the cells dirty, and then keep them dirty. 'Grotty' is the word they use.

LJ

 

[drex]

Thanks all . So usual with beekeeping you take your pick. I have tried the new cups into hive to get bees working on them. Will try making them grotty with a bit of wax. See how that works.

 

[Little John]

To be honest, I'm a bit surprised that the condition of the cups is considered of such significance, as the only part of the queen that gets anywhere near the cup is the tip of her abdomen.

Indeed, if you read Stickler's 1981-3 Patent US4392262 , which I believe is the forerunner to both the Nicot and Jenter systems, he talks about either fitting a wax plate to the front of the cell matrix, or coating an embossed face-plate with a wax spray. That would seem to suggest that it's the face-plate itself which really needs to develop a 'mature' smell and/or texture, rather more than the cups.

So - it might be worth applying some wax 'grot' to the front of the face plate as well, if only to disguise the smell of plastic ...

LJ

 

[Apple]

smear everything with royal jelly and propolis mix from the colony you are using, be sure to put the Nicot or Jenter cage between two brood frames in area where queen has been laying.
Seem to be a 100% success in WBC smaller boxed with the Amm stock I am so fortunate to have!
Possibly the cup kit type systems may be too small for the fat bodied hybrids???


James

 

[Ben Smith]

Have also just bought one of these so will be interested to hear what works out for you.

 

[Black Comb]

Well mine worked fine with honey and clean cells.

 

[Ben Smith]

Did you just use honey and no wax? Was the honey taken from the same hive?

 

[Black Comb]

no wax
honey was from last year, not from same hive.
the idea is to get the workers to "clean out" the cells as they would in normal comb.

 

[drex]

Just an update. At inspection yesterday. Queen in bottom BB, laying well. In top BB, two supercedure cells, bang in middle, next to each other. Coincidence? Caused by my manipulation ? Reason she was reluctant to lay in cup kit? Although laying well again. There were no QC present when I tried her in caupkit, and no others now.

 

[masterBK]

I used brand new Cupkit this year without any wax or honey pretreatment but did put it in the breeder colony for a two days. The queen laid it up fine but did delay about a day before she started laying.

 

[SixFooter]

Tried a cup kit 3 times over the last few years. 3 different colonies, but none of the queens laid any eggs. I didn't try putting honey or wax in the cups though. Maybe I'll have another go and try that.

 

[Hawklord]

When's the best time to remove the queen from the cassette? Also when do the cups need to go onto the cell bar?

 

[Apple]

When's the best time to remove the queen from the cassette? Also when do the cups need to go onto the cell bar?

Queen to cassette day 0
Let her out after 24 hours day 1( put in at midday and let her out following midday)
eggs hatch day 3
Some leave cassette in queenright colony to day 5 before putting into cellbar in a q-(on top) colony.
( Some use colony with brood but with queen removed)
that will be 3 day old larvae

check accepted on day 6
check sealed day 8
q cells to incubator and caged day 14

15 to 18 queens hatch

Try to get virgins into previously prepped mating nucs soon after hatching and up to mating site with strong drone filled colonies.
Day 23 check for mated queen laying eggs. AND viable workers not drones!


Good luck


James

 

[Hawklord]

Thanks James.

 

[Apple]

Thanks, it usually works!

James

 

[Little John]

When's the best time to remove the queen from the cassette?

Have a look at the base of the cell cups - when you see some royal jelly being deposited there, that is the time to remove the queen. Sometimes queens can take an extra day to get started.

There's a very good video which shows this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LxV0V9f3NB8

LJ