Buckfast Queen

[drstitson]

But in terms of crosses I took HM to mean that his BF queens, outcrossed to local drones (ie not in his isolated apiaries) produced ok hybrid offspring (presumably feedback from clients and own experience with non controlled stocks).

 

[Tom Bick]

So the more people that keep the Buckfast type bee the better for everyone.

 

[Ziggymole]

Originaly posted by icanhopit
"Constant interbreeding without "new" stock introduced causes many defects, as with dog breeders with a limited gene pool deformities get amplified."

I'm getting ready to keep bees. I wouldn't say I was isolated but I haven't seen a honeybee here in the valley for at least 5 years. Am I going to have problems with inbreeding? (I have an overly inbred pedigree cat and am learning the consequences)
My hive is a Warre so I will have trouble introducing a new queen every few years too.

 

[Bob Bee]

Poster should note hivemaker has the drone saturation of all of his Buckie colonies in his area. So much more likely to be the same strain.

Op, the only way is to see what the next queen is like.
Unless you want to continually want to re-introduce buckfast queens, then you will always be faced with this as you cannot control her mating. You will end up with a local bee, which if you continually select the best from, you will have the best bee for your area and it will be more sustainable.

Absolutely.

 

[Bob Bee]

Originaly posted by icanhopit
"Constant interbreeding without "new" stock introduced causes many defects, as with dog breeders with a limited gene pool deformities get amplified."

I'm getting ready to keep bees. I wouldn't say I was isolated but I haven't seen a honeybee here in the valley for at least 5 years. Am I going to have problems with inbreeding? (I have an overly inbred pedigree cat and am learning the consequences)
My hive is a Warre so I will have trouble introducing a new queen every few years too.

Your very unlikely to have any such problem, completely different to dogs, bees.

 

[For want of a better word]

So the more people that keep the Buckfast type bee the better for everyone.

Any bee that is suited for your particular environmental conditions and does not die over winter, good on the comb and does not sting ping and follow, is disease tolerant dose not consume all its stores at a drop in flow, is productive in terms of brood and honey and does not swarm at every opportunity!
That is what bee improvement is all about.

So called Buckfast may do this for you without the need to requeen from far far away every new season ( or two)

We are lucky to have AMM stock that is looking good in the Rame area, the more north, east and west you go there bee NZ Carnies and so called Bucckfasts...

 

[Ziggymole]

Your very unlikely to have any such problem, completely different to dogs, bees.

So even though my queens will only likely ever be mated by drones they have laid there shouldn't be any problems. Is that right?
I'm worried that I'll end up populating the whole valley with closely related stock. (I shouldn't have problems with disease being brought in though)

 

[VEG]

which valley are you from ziggymole?

 

[johnandyrob]

Drones fly allot further than workers

 

[Ziggymole]

Hi Craig
I'm right at the very top of Cwmaman/Glynhafod, Aberdare.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

I'm worried that I'll end up populating the whole valley with closely related stock.

I think that's already happened in a lot of South Wales communities!

 

[Ziggymole]

No comment - I can't - I'm English!! But I have added some of my genes to the local stock so we'll see

 

[For want of a better word]

IS that a real mole ?
or one of those hamster things my kids keep leaving on the floor for me to trip over ????

 

[Ziggymole]

IS that a real mole ?
or one of those hamster things my kids keep leaving on the floor for me to trip over ????

That's a real mole - as caught by the cat and brought home for our approval. He was rehomed in the horse field opposite. Hamster things wouldn't last 2 minutes on a rug here.
It's not how I got my "handle" though. Ziggy was a cat who kept burying himself in piles of clothes, blankets, under rugs etc etc = Ziggy the mole.

 

[Bob Bee]

So even though my queens will only likely ever be mated by drones they have laid there shouldn't be any problems. Is that right?
I'm worried that I'll end up populating the whole valley with closely related stock. (I shouldn't have problems with disease being brought in though)

You will find that you are not as isolated as you suspect, there will be plenty of local stock to avoid the sort of in breeding your concerned about. A truly isolated area is the holy grail for bee breeders and if there was one in your area, believe me, it would have been found and utilised. BIBBA , BibCo and people on the forum quite near you would have made good use of such an area.
The best advice so far is to wait and see what your new colony is like and then make progress slowly and surely to select your colonies for good traits which will mean you develop a good local bee suited to your area. If it turns out that you are pretty well isolated, you will be able to develop the skills to "Breed within a Strain" (whichever one YOU choose) and never need to import a queen, unless you actually want to. Believe me, there are plenty who want to sell you stuff to no advantage.

 

[For want of a better word]

You will find that you are not as isolated as you suspect, there will be plenty of local stock to avoid the sort of in breeding your concerned about. A truly isolated area is the holy grail for bee breeders and if there was one in your area, believe me, it would have been found and utilised. BIBBA , BibCo and people on the forum quite near you would have made good use of such an area.
The best advice so far is to wait and see what your new colony is like and then make progress slowly and surely to select your colonies for good traits which will mean you develop a good local bee suited to your area. If it turns out that you are pretty well isolated, you will be able to develop the skills to "Breed within a Strain" (whichever one YOU choose) and never need to import a queen, unless you actually want to. Believe me, there are plenty who want to sell you stuff to no advantage.

Nice to see you are singing from the same songsheet Bob !

 

[drstitson]

"So even though my queens will only likely ever be mated by drones they have laid there shouldn't be any problems. Is that right?"

NO. if truly isolated and only drones are related to HM then you will have problems with weak colonies with pepperpot brood due to diploid drones.

You need unrelated drone colonies to mate with your queens.

NB - according to talk at BBKA today - queens and drones tend to head different distances and directions from their hive, minimising risk of inbreeding (given the chance).

 

[Andre cardona]

ok wers the best plais to get a Buckfast queen from

 

[onriver]

if your virgin queen is able to mate with up to 50 drones, there has to be an assumption that this is because a wide gene pool has long tern effectiveness for the species as a whole. If she can't, either deliberately through AI or because of limited availability of drones due to remoteness or drone culling, you get a short term gain (F1 tomatoes, for example) but a long term disadvantage for the species....?

 

[BBG]

ok wers the best plais to get a Buckfast queen from

At the moment, Hivemaker looks a good bet for reliable, productive Queens.