Beginners Dilema!

[einsteinagogo]

Need some friendly assitance and advice, inspected today, because a swarm appeared 10m from from my Apiary, this was spotted on Monday this week, but had gone, when I got to site to collect, another beekeeper stated it would not stay because of the weather and rain coming.

Today, another (or the same) swarm appeared in the same location, this time I've been able to box, and hive it, on queen excluder, solid floor, on foundation this evening. This was a heavy box of bees, compared to smaller casts I've caught from my colony in my garden (another story that one!). So many bees, that I had to wait for the frames to settle before closing up, and they'd started to draw comb in the swarm box!

Hive No.2

So, I thought I must inspect the two colonies at the site. I'll start with Hive No.2, which was the suspect colony, which may have swarmed, when looking through clear crown board, I could immediately notice less bees, and this is what I found

10 frames drawn, 1 drawing out, 5 frames of brood 3 frames of stores. No eggs, No larva, plenty of capped broad.

and one supercedure cells, these were half way down the frames, not on the ends of the frames, no charged queen cells. So I'm assuming supercedure cells, as they were not hanging at the bottom of the frames.

So I marked the frame with pin, and closed up. Did not see queen.

Hive No.1

I thought, this one does not look as busy, or strong as Hive No.2, and it's always been behind, in drawing frames, stores.

I saw the queen, Red Marked, overwintered 2013, did not see eggs, larva, but plenty of sealed brood.

plenty of laying space......

So in Summary...

Hive No.2 - Leave them alone, and let them get on with it!

Hive No.1 - re-queen ?

(both Hives were from 6 frame nucs, installed in nationals on 18 April 2014, so not quite 4 weeks)

I do have a collected swarm possibly from Hive No.2, I could unite with Hive No.1, and catch the queen and put her in a nuc of her own, and see what happenes.

Anyway friendly advice welcome, it's been a big learning curve.

(just let me also report, I was told that both queens are sisters, if this has any bearing on the situation!)

 

[beeno]

Hi Andy,
I am sooo pleased for you. Maybe now these colonies of yours will settle down. Well, done for hanging in there! Hive no. 2 a little peek on the marked frame at the estimated time of emergence just to make sure it is not a dud cell. Swarm, I would put a super on to give them more seating room in the short run if you think they are crowded. I would be patient with Hive 1 it is still early in the season. However, a bit strange to be on a brood break this time of the year. Did they have any stores - just had to feed one of my colonies that had gone all out for brood!
Well done again, you are back in control.

 

[einsteinagogo]

Hi Andy,
I am sooo pleased for you. Maybe now these colonies of yours will settle down. Well, done for hanging in there! Hive no. 2 a little peek on the marked frame at the estimated time of emergence just to make sure it is not a dud cell. Swarm, I would put a super on to give them more seating room in the short run if you think they are crowded. I would be patient with Hive 1 it is still early in the season. However, a bit strange to be on a brood break this time of the year. Did they have any stores - just had to feed one of my colonies that had gone all out for brood!
Well done again, you are back in control.

Thanks for the confidence boost!

Super, yes, good idea, will do this this evening.

Yes, Hive No.1 is odd, yes they have stores, plenty of forage around OSR and Field Beans, and I was feeding 1:1 syrup to encourage drawing of frames, seems coincidence that both Hive No.1 & 2, both seem to stop at same time, and they are both sisters! (and Hive 2 swarmed on supersedure maybe!)

Thanks again

 

[Skyhook]

One of the annoying things about bees is that they don't read the books. The dscription sounds like a supercedure cell, but they obviously considered it a swarm cell.

Not sure if it was one cell or more, and at what stage?

If hive 1 has no eggs she could have taken a break for the weather- or they could have slimmed the queen down for swarming and you missed the queen cell/s. Worth checking carefully.

As regards hive 2, you now have to decide how many hives you want. If you want 3, you now have them- but bear in mind the swarm now has an ageing queen who is likely to swarm again next year, if not this.

If you only want 2 then wait until a new queen is established, then kill the old queen and re-combine. Remember big colonies make honey- people who keep all of their AS's tend to end up with lots of hives and not much honey.

.

 

[einsteinagogo]

One of the annoying things about bees is that they don't read the books. The dscription sounds like a supercedure cell, but they obviously considered it a swarm cell.

Not sure if it was one cell or more, and at what stage?

If hive 1 has no eggs she could have taken a break for the weather- or they could have slimmed the queen down for swarming and you missed the queen cell/s. Worth checking carefully.

As regards hive 2, you now have to decide how many hives you want. If you want 3, you now have them- but bear in mind the swarm now has an ageing queen who is likely to swarm again next year, if not this.

If you only want 2 then wait until a new queen is established, then kill the old queen and re-combine. Remember big colonies make honey- people who keep all of their AS's tend to end up with lots of hives and not much honey.

.

There was only one sealed cell in Hive 2, as these are not quite 4 week old nucs, 6 frame transferred into nationals, frames are quite new, and easy to check through.

Checked Hive No.1 carefully, not queen cells, play cups, sealed or unsealed. (less bees!)

I do not want more than 3, I have another in the garden, so 3 hives is enough.

I've got a few options, as I see it,

check H1 again, to check if see comes back into lay. (7 days)
check H2 again, later to check if queen emerges

Build up H2 swarm, and then unit with H1 or H2.

and H1 (garden), check on them if queen right now.

I quite like the idea of Buckfast bees and queens, but that maybe thinking ahead....