ball of bees in hive roof - help

[encle]

I peered under the roof as I had left some fondant there some weeks ago and was checking if they had finished. I was confronted with a huge amount of bees standing around and even more worryingly a ball of bees hanging there as well, see pics.
there's also a handful of bees hanging around on the landing board looking listless and this is at 8.15pm in the evening, when they are normally all tucked up.

what should I do?

 

[Vergilius]

Put a super on fast - your bees are running out of space. Block holes in CB with mesh.


Ben P

 

[Tom Bick]

Providing they can get back down into the hive then that’s ok for now they will go down when ready.

The probable reason at a guess is they are running out of space and are thinking this roof is a good space to build comb.

Fondant is a waste of time at this time of year and especially in N10 they have plenty of forage and will be making increase at the moment so no need to feed.

Inspect them and look at the room situation and if needed give them a super or two

 

[encle]

the fondant was because I was trying to give them a good start in their new home, I transferred then from a 5 frame nuc box early march. that means they have filled up 7 frames in about 7 weeks?

and when you say mesh, what is that exactly?

 

[encle]

and when I put the super on do I knock the hanging bees into the super or just put the super on and leave them to it?

 

[Tom Bick]

When you put the super on you will also put the queen excluder on top of the bb first so you will have to look and see that the queen is not amongst the bees in the roof. If you are happy that she is not then you can knock the bees into the super and then the crown board over that.

 

[MuswellMetro]

Put a super on fast - your bees are running out of space. Block holes in CB with mesh.


Ben P

Encle

lets start from the begining

if i remember correctly you are on a standard deep brood and only drawn out 6 frames and 5 of foundation or has this improved?

if so dont put a super on, i suspect they are young bees sweating out wax onto their wax mirrors at the warmest point in the hive

1) take off the fondant

2) block up the feed hole, i would use 4mm ply, you can use mesh but i would say only use mesh if you are on solid floors, i leave my feed holes/porter holes closed al year and only open to feed or clear

3)shake all the bees in the into the hive, they may yet not done their first flight

4) take the varroa baord out, too cool them down


5) entrance block out until august

 

[encle]

right, am going out there tomorrow with a super to see what's occurring.

thanks everyone, and to answer your question muswell metro yep I started with a 5 frame nuc box and transferred them over to a hive of 12 frames(?).

any ideas why they'd be bees hanging around on the landing board so late?

 

[MuswellMetro]

Encle

my post crossed

are you saying they are on 7 newly drawn+5 drawn in Nuc =12 frames all drawn out or you saying 7 drawn frames and 4 foundation frames left to draw

 

[thurrock bees]

put one or maybe two supers on, its better to have too much space than too little at this time of year.

if they are on the landing board, there maybe no room inside the hive for them, i had that a couple of years back.

 

[MuswellMetro]

any ideas why they'd be bees hanging around on the landing board so late?

they could be overcrowded or fanning the air to cool down the hive or fanning to evaporate the necter to make honey

i better put a biat hive the other side of of muswell hill golf course if it is the first

mesh, ie metal OMF floor type material


i dont like 12 frames in a national ( they must be hoffmans ) and prefer 11 plus a dummy aas it means you roll less bees taking the first frame out

 

[encle]

this is a completely new hive. they overwintered in the nuc box on 5 frames, and I moved them over to the hive last month. there's 7 undrawn frames in there. I haven't looked in there for a while, because I didn't think much would be occurring, ie I thought 7 new frames would keep them busy for a while!!

 

[encle]

now that you mention it there were a lot of bees fanning in the roof when I looked.

 

[MuswellMetro]

this is a completely new hive. they overwintered in the nuc box on 5 frames, and I moved them over to the hive last month. there's 7 undrawn frames in there. I haven't looked in there for a while, because I didn't think much would be occurring, ie I thought 7 new frames would keep them busy for a while!!

lets see whats in there first, i have had 5 frame nuc that did not make 6 frames of brood all season and other that went to 9 brrod and 2 stores and on to fill two or three supers,, so discuss later when you have looked inside, but take a super just in case it is full to bursting

normally i would have said to someone as close to you, that i would pop over to look but i am tied up most of the weekend ~(usual fee is a pint in the Maid of Muswell), do yuo have a mentor

 

[encle]

nope no mentor! I am with NLB but ashamed to say I haven't got to any meetings yet.
am off work this week so will be looking tomorrow, will let you know.
thanks!

 

[encle]

ok so have checked them this morning and the ball of bees has gone from the roof. I went through the frames and they have clearly run out of space. I put a super on, blocked up the crown board though not sure if this is needed. final question is the qx ok between the bb and the super or should it be above the super? am I trying to create more space for the queen or more space for stores?

thanks

 

[SimonB]

I will stick my neck out here and have a go at answering this, but take note I'm a beginner also.

Firstly did you look for/spot any queen cells. I went from brood on 4 frames in a 14x12 to brood on 9 frames, sealed queen cells and swarmed within 2 weeks. If you did find queen cells then you need to start swarm control measures now, most probably an artificial swarm.

If there are no queen cells and the queen still has space to lay in then I would think QX between BB and super, but consider scoring some of the stores nearer the centre of the brood to encourage them to move them upstairs.

If they are rammed full then consider going to brood and half and using the super for brood, in which case QX is not needed as yet, just crownboard on top with any holes sealed.

Some find that bees are initially reluctant to move through a QX into a super, especially if the super contains just foundation, and suggest leaving the QX off for a few days, or spraying some sugar syrup onto the foundation. If the queen does start laying then you can fit the QX ensuring the queen is not in the super, and then replace those frames with fresh wax once the brood has hatched.

Hope that is some help.

 

[encle]

I did find what looked like a queen cell and destroyed it. also got rid of some drones and lots of brace comb.

 

[MuswellMetro]

I did find what looked like a queen cell and destroyed it. also got rid of some drones and lots of brace comb.

did it have white jelly in it

 

[encle]

did it have white jelly in it

possibly yes.
what do you think about the qx, should it be above or below the super I've just put on?