A Welsh Flow Hive Harvest

[Karol]

I wish. Missed it all except the traffic. Love Cardiff though.

 

[GaryB]

Sorry no.....the family scoffs everything!
It's so easy to do though...buy a book and just follow the steps. Or these days look up online. You could be eating your own bacon in a few days!
The wonderful thing about home cured bacon is that when you fry it...it crisps up beautifully....no milky liquid gumming up the pan.

Thank you Tremyfro. You have sparked my taste buds. I will have to investigate, and your absolutely right, that store bought stuff comes nowhere near.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Unless you live in Carmarthenshire where most butchers stock proper welsh bacon or you can pop down to Albert Rees in Carmrthen market for either Welsh ham or bacon.

 

[Tremyfro]

Thank you Tremyfro. You have sparked my taste buds. I will have to investigate, and your absolutely right, that store bought stuff comes nowhere near.

Let us know how you get on...'bringing home the bacon' will take on a new meaning in your household!

 

[Erichalfbee]

Flow have just posted that you should check the channel before harvest and if the honey there is dirty clean it with a bottle brush.

 

[Tremyfro]

I saw that some time ago....but I think they have reposted it since people have been asking questions about the cleanliness of the tube.
Here is some info from the Flow forum where this issue is being discussed.

Info on bacterial growth in honey....
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2269714/1

Info on water activity/humidity and honey....
http://bibliotecadigital.uca.edu.ar...nature-relationship-water-moisture-honey.pdf1

Info on biological growth in food at different water activities
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/9780470376454.app4/pdf1

 

[For want of a better word]

Unless you live in Carmarthenshire where most butchers stock proper welsh bacon or you can pop down to Albert Rees in Carmrthen market for either Welsh ham or bacon.

Got any recipes for the famous Narbeth Badger Ham......... ???

Nos da

 

[charlievictorbravo]

I saw that some time ago....but I think they have reposted it since people have been asking questions about the cleanliness of the tube.
Here is some info from the Flow forum where this issue is being discussed.

Info on bacterial growth in honey....
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2269714/1

Info on water activity/humidity and honey....
http://bibliotecadigital.uca.edu.ar...nature-relationship-water-moisture-honey.pdf1

Info on biological growth in food at different water activities
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/9780470376454.app4/pdf1

Tremy

Can't get any of the links to work. Any ideas?

CVB

 

[Tremyfro]

Tremy

Can't get any of the links to work. Any ideas?

CVB

You could go on the Flow Hive forum and follow the post....they work on there....don't know why they don't on my post!
Anyway...pretty much what they say is that botulism doesn't grow in the honey as any residue doesn't absorb enough water to dilute it that much...given the humidity in the hive. Plus oxygen levels are too high for botulism as it is an anaerobic. Botulism spores are found in honey....in raw and heat treated and so recommended not to feed to infants as their digestive system is immature and the botulism spores can develop. That the levels of microbes in Flow honey > clean jars are lower than in honey which undergoes more industrialised or more handling processes....which makes sense. However, honey has to be diluted quite a bit before it loses its ability to be an antibacterial.
Personally, I am not worried that the Flow frames will grow pathogens between harvests but I think it is sensible to remove any debri from the channel...if there is any there. This can be affected by wrapping a surface cleaning wipe around a small bottle brush and inserting into the channel.

 

[Anduril]

Tremy

Can't get any of the links to work. Any ideas?

CVB

This looks like one of them which can be downloaded in pdf format

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2269714/#!po=0.925926

 

[Anduril]

http://bibliotecadigital.uca.edu.ar...cion/nature-relationship-water-moisture-honey
Looks as though this one is working.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

So is Botulinus the only pathogen creeping around out there? I'm afraid you're all chasing a hare sprung by that little maggot Truble in his efforts to troll Karol.

 

[Anduril]

Cannot get the last link to work, however there was a nice pic of drone brood in the flow frames on the flow forum.

 

[Karol]

Managed to track down the forum. Glad to see that the issue is being given the respect that it deserves even if (according to some) I'm nothing but a troll looking for a fight!

Some time back SWMBO (who is also a pharmacist - and much much better than me) conducted a review on the use of honey in wound treatment and I was privileged to get an overview of her findings. Yes honey can be very useful therapeutically but it can also be problematic if used incorrectly. This article is pretty fair and gives a rough synopsis of what SWMBO found:

http://www.worldwidewounds.com/2001/november/Molan/honey-as-topical-agent.html

So coming into this debate I was already alert to some of the issues. The danger comes from bias and the belief that honey is self sterilizing whereas in fact the bactericidal and bacteriostatic properties of honey vary considerably:

http://www.bee-hexagon.net/files/file/fileE/Honey/Bogdanov_LWT_1997_sb.pdf

As beekeepers using Flow Hives can't necessarily control the nature of the honey being produced by their bees, the level of risk will vary considerably. In the absence of a rigorous approach to hygiene all it will take is a coincidental alignment of conditions for something to go badly wrong.

 

[Anduril]

http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/9780470376454.app4/pdf
Got it working if this is the one. Nice pics on the Flow Forum Tremyfro

 

[Cussword]

Managed to track down the forum. Glad to see that the issue is being given the respect that it deserves even if (according to some) I'm nothing but a troll looking for a fight!.

Karol, if you are referring to JBM'S post you should read it again. He was referring to truble the troll.

Fortunately he can no longer cause any upset.

 

[Tremyfro]

http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/9780470376454.app4/pdf
Got it working if this is the one. Nice pics on the Flow Forum Tremyfro

Thank you...and thanks for getting the links to work too!
As I have said before...the honey produced from a Flow frame is no more at risk from contamination than honey from wax frames...which are extracted. The articles are giving information about honey...any honey and its floral origins...and the microbes from the bees themselves...which is the same for all honey.
I think all beekeepers should ensure their honey is extracted using good hygienic practises...no matter what extraction process they use.

 

[Karol]

Karol, if you are referring to JBM'S post you should read it again. He was referring to truble the troll.

Fortunately he can no longer cause any upset.

I wasn't referring to JBM. It was with reference to the Flow Hive forum.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Par for the course, in fact, it's surprising they haven't deleted your post - that's their usual MO

 

[Tremyfro]

Par for the course, in fact, it's surprising they haven't deleted your post - that's their usual MO

I think you might be wrong there JBM.....the only time I have seen deleted posts was when we had a rather zealous forum guardian! Since then very few have been deleted.....and mainly if personal comments are made. Strangely, if there is a difference of opinion...it leads to discussion rather than expulsion.
Overlooking forum discussions works both ways...as there are people who have a membership in both forums. We must remember that the Flow forum was started for people who bought the Flow frames...some of whom were already beekeepers and many who were not...however, it has led to a lot of sharing of information not only about beekeeping but also about the use of the frames. The help that the Flow team have offered Flow frame owners is unprecedented in world wide beekeeping....in the form of instruction, forum access, training and an open door for queries.