Why did they die?

[Boston Bees]

I lost 2, and can only suspect varroa. Were on 8 frames of bees going into Winter. Super under brood box.. No obvious varroa problems with bee presentation.
Worrying as I did oxalic sublimation in December. Dropped about 150 varroa. There were hardly any bees on the frames and 1" deep bodies on the floor. Queen seen amongst them. Food stores were plentiful. I struggled to lift the brood box when clearing up. I wonder if the treatment infiltrates the cluster..
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[Boston Bees]

I lost 2, and can only suspect varroa. Were on 8 frames of bees going into Winter. Super under brood box.. No obvious varroa problems with bee presentation.
Worrying as I did oxalic sublimation in December. Dropped about 150 varroa. There were hardly any bees on the frames and 1" deep bodies on the floor. Queen seen amongst them. Food stores were plentiful. I struggled to lift the brood box when clearing up. I wonder if the treatment infiltrates the cluster..

Sorry to hear that.

Did you treat in August /September ?

Winter OA treatment doesn't do much if anything for winter survival of course, it's more about the health of the colony the next spring.

 

[beeno]

Just between you and me, her name isn't Erica ....

Sorry Dani. Mine isn't Beeno.

 

[beeno]

My point was that a colony swarming in late August wouldn’t be viable anyway. Like Philip says. It’s dead, learn and move on.

If the queen mates which is the salient point, why not? She has a hive with stores and a good complement of capped brood, foragers and drawn comb. Winter bees are produced in Sept/Oct. It is the swarm that has to do all the work with the mated queen.

 

[Heather]

Sorry to hear that.

Did you treat in August /September ?


The drop was quite low on the inspection insert, in August and plenty brood, so decided to just do December hit. Probably a mistake But all others ok. ... so far !. Have got load of MAQS in now ..just in case I need to do interim treatment

 

[oliver90owner]

If that brood and a half (no super involved?) was full of stores going into winter they should not have been short of stores by now. As Dani (and Beano) stated - likely never got going after swarming. Somehow I doubt the hive was well stocked before the winter - with bees or stores

 

[Monbees]

If that brood and a half (no super involved?) was full of stores going into winter they should not have been short of stores by now. As Dani (and Beano) stated - likely never got going after swarming. Somehow I doubt the hive was well stocked before the winter - with bees or stores

I'm grateful for all the input and advice on why my colony died. Weather awful today so haven't been able to check the floor to see if there are drones although I did see some when l was clearing dead bees from the entrance a couple of days previously. That probably confirms what a number of replies are saying, that the new queen was not well-mated and failed after initially laying (l did check for eggs and sealed brood after three weeks). l did not check again before treating with thymol strips, then feeding. Obviously l should have checked again as the swarm had issued late. I did heft the hive and it seemed heavy although, being a novice l may not be experienced enough at hefting.
Thank you everyone, l shall be better informed in future. Living and learning.

 

[The Poot]

The fondant was immediately above the cluster, with a 50p size hole nibbled through which I assumed meant they had been eating it. It was quite a strong hive going into autumn, although the colony swarmed quite late (august). I caught and housed the swarm, which has overwintered well.

Sorry to read of your loss Monbees. At least you’ve got the old queen/swarm to continue with.
I hope you get through the rest of the Winter with no further issues, then you can reintroduce the swarm to its old home

 

[Amari]

Did you say they swarmed in late August and you left them in brood and a half?
Did you check they had a laying queen before you prepped them for winter?

They swarmed - and then may have lost a few casts. There were few bees in the photos.

 

[Antipodes]

This is the first season I have tried brood and a half and I wonder if it would have been better to reduce them to just a brood box so not to have so much space to heat up. I'd say the colony size was a good average, not huge.

Don't think bee poo on the frames but I will check tomorrow.

In the last of the four photos, it looks like there are two undrawn frames in the box. Is that the case?

 

[Monbees]

In the last of the four photos, it looks like there are two undrawn frames in the box. Is that the case?

Yes, l guess l should either have dummied or reduced them to single brood box. Alas, lots of things l did wrong with this hive.

 

[Monbees]

Yes, l guess l should either have dummied or reduced them to single brood box. Alas, lots of things l did wrong with this hive.

If nothing at the entrance indicates any problem within the hive, how often would most beekeepers inspect the brood box in the autumn, after fear of swarming is over?

 

[pargyle]

If nothing at the entrance indicates any problem within the hive, how often would most beekeepers inspect the brood box in the autumn, after fear of swarming is over?

I wouldn't criticise you for not looking in but there's a couple of good reasons why perhaps you should have - but don't beat yourself up about it - we all get it wrong sometimes.

1. After they swarmed I would want to know (particularly as it was a late swarm) that there was a really good brood pattern and a bit later that the queen was laying up the winter bees.

2. Stores .. I like to know at the end of the season what stores they have in the brood box. If you were intending leaving them with a super with honey on there I would have really preferred it to be nadired and if there was space for stores in the brood box I would have probably scratched the cappings to get them to move them up.

3. If there were undrawn frames in there at the end of the season it's a pretty good indication that it's a smaller colony and I would have taken any undrawn frames out and replaced them with blocks of insulation - or possibly just transferred them to a nuc.

But ... hindsight is a pretty exact science and I can see myself making the same assumptions you did .. we all try and learn from other people's mistakes but the ones that educate us best are those we make ourselves.

 

[beeno]

If nothing at the entrance indicates any problem within the hive, how often would most beekeepers inspect the brood box in the autumn, after fear of swarming is over?

I will be generous 3 weeks after emergence if she is not laying then I would have united as they are doomed if she cannot produce winter bees. With a new queen you do have to inspect to ensure she is laying and that it is worker brood. You cannot judge the size of a colony either by looking at the hive entrance.

 

[Antipodes]

Yes, l guess l should either have dummied or reduced them to single brood box. Alas, lots of things l did wrong with this hive.

I reckon that sounds right about the space reduction. I read years ago about how bees can reduce the space that they occupy with temperature reduction. I'll have a look for it again. Really fascinating.

 

[Erichalfbee]

If nothing at the entrance indicates any problem within the hive, how often would most beekeepers inspect the brood box in the autumn, after fear of swarming is over?

In addition to pargyles comment. I do look through and check all broods thoroughly for disease

 

[Amari]

If nothing at the entrance indicates any problem within the hive, how often would most beekeepers inspect the brood box in the autumn, after fear of swarming is over?

After the swarm left did you check the brood box to look for and destroy any remaining queen cells except one? Your colony might have been further depleted (and delayed in re-establishing) by losing one or more cast swarms.

 

[Monbees]

After the swarm left did you check the brood box to look for and destroy any remaining queen cells except one? Your colony might have been further depleted (and delayed in re-establishing) by losing one or more cast swarms.

No, I'm afraid l didn't. Yet another no-no.

 

[pargyle]

No, I'm afraid l didn't. Yet another no-no.

Well should be quite easy to find out if multiple swarms were part of the cause ... have a look at the frames for vacated queen cells... they are sometimes well hidden in and around the edges of the comb.. it is not going to be much consolation and probably not that productive but at least you will be able to look for queen cells without bees doing their best to hide them from you. Good opportunity to find queen cells and see where they construct them - theres always a silver lining !

 

[Antipodes]

No, I'm afraid l didn't. Yet another no-no.

Do let us know in due course if the queen is with the dead ones.
All the best with the bees.