what would you do

[irishguy]

Sorry, it isn't a 'vetting card' it's a Veterinary Medicine Record Card. If you had followed the link you would have read the rules that apply not just within UK but throughout Europe. You're meant to keep your own records, not rely on a distributor or anybody else to keep the records for you.

As Dusty said, Less messing, more patience.

If you poke around inside your colonies in a couple of weeks time you'll really mess up their winter preparations because it will be that much colder, so it will take them longer to redo the work you've undone - and they should be concentrating on other things.

If you were to find a supersedure cell, what would you do with it? It's quite common for beekeepers to open their hives in the Spring for the first inspection of the season and find two queens living in tandem. One will probably have been a late 'supersedure'.

So - don't look! Leave them alone now, let them have some peace until Spring.

I'll fill out this form in the coming days, thanks for reminding me.

I won't be opening the hive in a few weeks however I'll be doing one thing in a few days and that will be taking that brood box off very quickly and cover the hives in the insulation I've made up. I'll continue to feed with my rapid feeder until they've stopped taking the feed down. With the 4inch thick insulation and feed, they'll over winter OK, I'm confident they will. I know some will probably disagree with me taking this brood box but it has to be done, 1 because its just to much room for them, 2 they are ply hives and 3, I've already made up the insulation to the .measurements for all 3 hives so it has to be done. If I'm quick enough, I'll remove what's left over from the strips.

 

[Nige.Coll]

get a plan and stick to it. regardless of what others say.
don't keep changing it because someone said it was better to do this.
remember one thing beekeepers can't agree on the colour of a carpet nevermind how you should look after bees.

 

[irishguy]

Forgot to post this earlier. I took a pic under 1 hive with the maq strip in and noticed all this stuff lying on the mesh floor. I'm wondering is it them getting rid of the strips. There's was a strong smell coming from under the hive which is the strips. Never expected it to be that strong still



View attachment 10925

 

[Dusty Rhodes]

Irishguy, please, stop messing.

Minimal interference, maximum patience is what is required.

I know how anxiety provoking it is when starting to keep bees.
But it's essential to master your own anxiety and let the bees work out their own strategy for dealing with it.

In the great majority of cases, the more a Beek messes, the more unstable they make the situation.

Especially at this time of the year, they need time and space to get their affairs in order. Winter is tough on them. Let them prepare for it.

The best beeks I know are those with gentleness and patience.
The worst are those who go crashing in and mess with them.

Doucement, mon ami, doucement.


Dusty

 

[pargyle]

Forgot to post this earlier. I took a pic under 1 hive with the maq strip in and noticed all this stuff lying on the mesh floor. I'm wondering is it them getting rid of the strips. There's was a strong smell coming from under the hive which is the strips. Never expected it to be that strong still

View attachment 10925

Looks more like dead bees to me ... sorry ... it's difficult to tell from this angle whether they are live bees in a cluster on the bottom of the frames or dead ones piled on the mesh floor.

But Dusty is bang on the money ...whatever it is, there's nothing to be done about it .. just let them be.

 

[Nige.Coll]

MAQS kills bees you knew that.
you seem to be trying to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory.
why did you need to treat for varroa ?
these colonies were tiny a month ago.
Varroa was the least of your worries this year imo.
You'de have to have had 5 varroa per bee to be a threat. why didn't you use OA dribble at christmas like you were told.
YOU ARE LISTENING TO TOO MANY PEOPLE MATE.....
pick 1 plan and stick to it .
It's only money/bees but you are doing yourself no favours.

 

[irishguy]

Looks more like dead bees to me ... sorry ... it's difficult to tell from this angle whether they are live bees in a cluster on the bottom of the frames or dead ones piled on the mesh floor.

But Dusty is bang on the money ...whatever it is, there's nothing to be done about it .. just let them be.

No that's a cluster of live bees. The pic was took just before dark when all bees where home. Its the light coloured stuff I was on about and it ain't pollen.

 

[irishguy]

MAQS kills bees you knew that.
you seem to be trying to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory.
why did you need to treat for varroa ?
these colonies were tiny a month ago.
Varroa was the least of your worries this year imo.
You'de have to have had 5 varroa per bee to be a threat. why didn't you use OA dribble at christmas like you were told.
YOU ARE LISTENING TO TOO MANY PEOPLE MATE.....
pick 1 plan and stick to it .
It's only money/bees but you are doing yourself no favours.

You'll have to ask jbm that because he was one who told me to treat. I was just following his advice thou I choose maqs because apiguard takes 4-6 weeks for treatment and mid range temps to work so I decided to go with maqs. TBH, I didn't want to treat because I never seen any mites at all but was told even thou I can't see them, their there so went with jbms advice and treated.

As for the OA dribble at xmass, I'd already treated by then so it was to late if I remember correctly but 090 suggested of a sort that it wasn't that great treatment. Its OK saying stick to one plan but I'm getting told all sorts from beeks here and also on this thread. Anyway, what's done is done now.

Again I have people telling me that there's lots if space to heat with extra brood box and then others say leave them alone. Can you see why my head is fcuked not knowing what to do.

 

[oliver90owner]

090 suggested of a sort-

I did no such thing. I was giving simple, direct advice, which you have time to consider long before Christmas arrives. Simple facts - oxalic reduces varroa to very low levels, if done properly at an opportune time; colonies weakened by nosema infection are prone to further damage including demise; healthy bees going into winter with low varroa infestations will not die out, due to the pest, over the winter period.

Simply put so you can understand why oxalic acid trickling in winter is not the panacea it is made out to be. It is a means to avoid in-season varroa treatments for those that would likely fail to manage without it; not a colony dead-out preventative, although it would help those that are unable to adequately control varroa infestations at the most opportune/appropriate times.

Simple facts. I have not used oxalic trickling in winter for about eight years. My winter losses have been rather less than half the apparent national average as I have often lost none (and only lost two this last winter) for the past eight years or so. Colony numbers have ranged from single figures up to over twenty in that time.

I abdicated from direct posting on this thread long ago as I judged you to be listening to all and none whilst running around like a headless chicken. It was clearly documented elsewhere - on a PM to a concerned forum member although not using those same words. JBM has done a sterling job in steering you in the right direction. It is unfortunate that recently you have not been following his good guiding advice and that other distractive posts have recurred.

My prediction, then, was two - possibly three - colonies into winter with a chance, but not so sure now....

As they say 'you can lead a horse to water, but ......'

 

[psafloyd]

Remember [spolier alert for Creationists] bees have been around for more than 180m years and have had to put up with a lot in that time, so they can cope pretty well with most things.

But if you keep fiddling, you won't have a clue which of your interventions produced the results.

Measure twice, cut once. You may still get it wrong with bees, but watch them and then do it differently NEXT time.

Irishguy, please, stop messing.

Minimal interference, maximum patience is what is required.

I know how anxiety provoking it is when starting to keep bees.
But it's essential to master your own anxiety and let the bees work out their own strategy for dealing with it.

In the great majority of cases, the more a Beek messes, the more unstable they make the situation.

Especially at this time of the year, they need time and space to get their affairs in order. Winter is tough on them. Let them prepare for it.

The best beeks I know are those with gentleness and patience.
The worst are those who go crashing in and mess with them.

Doucement, mon ami, doucement.


Dusty

 

[Davelin]

Looks like chalk brood in your pic, nothing to be done about it now.

 

[Nige.Coll]

not surprised about the chalkbrood the colony not being able to keep the temp up in the hive could be a big part of that.

IG has his bees survival at heart but this thread has frustrated the hell out of me.
JBM deserves a medal for the help given.

IG it is well known that if you ask 3 beekeepers the same question you will get 5 different answers.
You seem to be talking to too many people and confusing yourself with the information given to you resulting in you running round in ever decreasing circles.
Stick to one plan.

I'm a new beekeeper myself and asking too many people leads to conflicting advice and total confusion. Been there done that.

I've had problems with hives nearly lost 2 due to sprays but instead of asking the world I asked 2 people then researched the problem in books and on the net. Devised a plan and stuck to it. They went from 3 seems of bees to 9 in quite a short time once it was sorted.
They are resilient little beggars and bounce back well but that can all go down the pan if you mess with them too much.

An old beek told me it can take them 3 days to put the hive back in order after an inspection, try to remember that when you go tinkering around with them. Everytime you remove the crownboard all the heat and pheromones goes straight out the hive. It's a lot of stress for them.

anyway good luck with them and try to stick to 1 plan.

 

[irishguy]

Looks like chalk brood in your pic, nothing to be done about it now.

Think your right. Just looked at pics on net and looks like it but its like this, I would have got chalk brood anyway if i choose apiguard because I'd have had to open the hive more times to put apiguard in rather than just the once for maqs.

 

[irishguy]

not surprised about the chalkbrood the colony not being able to keep the temp up in the hive could be a big part of that.

IG has his bees survival at heart but this thread has frustrated the hell out of me.
JBM deserves a medal for the help given.

IG it is well known that if you ask 3 beekeepers the same question you will get 5 different answers.
You seem to be talking to too many people and confusing yourself with the information given to you resulting in you running round in ever decreasing circles.
Stick to one plan.

I'm a new beekeeper myself and asking too many people leads to conflicting advice and total confusion. Been there done that.

I've had problems with hives nearly lost 2 due to sprays but instead of asking the world I asked 2 people then researched the problem in books and on the net. Devised a plan and stuck to it. They went from 3 seems of bees to 9 in quite a short time once it was sorted.
They are resilient little beggars and bounce back well but that can all go down the pan if you mess with them too much.

An old beek told me it can take them 3 days to put the hive back in order after an inspection, try to remember that when you go tinkering around with them. Everytime you remove the crownboard all the heat and pheromones goes straight out the hive. It's a lot of stress for them.

anyway good luck with them and try to stick to 1 plan.

Right, stick to 1 plan, I was doing this until it was time to treat. I was given an option to choose my treatment so I had to bring other peoples opinion into it because I was told "decided on your treatment". I wouldn't have made that choice alone so best to ask about, which I did. Im very greatful of jbm for taking time to help me but he has to take some criticism himself for giving me that option and we wouldn't be hear disgusting this. If he'd of said right from the start, go get yourself apiguard instead of decided on your treatment then we wouldn't be here disgusting this. Yes I know he did suggest apiguard would be his choice to which I enquired about because he in UK and I'm on west coast of Ireland and to be told, it ain't going to work that great because of our temps in late sept/oct. I'll take all the criticism thrown at me but if people read this thread, they'll see in black and white where anyone could have been thrown in a different direction after these few words saying "decided on treatment".

Jbms long jumped ship from this thread but it would be nice of him to admit that he can see where I could of got confused and went and sought other peoples advice on treatment, after them few words about choosing my treatment thou I dare say he'll have lot more to say lol Anyway, what's done is done, ive made mistakes, jbm made mistake and I'm getting bit tired of repeating myself on it so I'm drawing a line under it and moving on. I just hope others can see my perspective on it but like I say, a line drawn and move o because when ya think about it, there's no point everyone getting their knickers in a twist when no one really knows the outcome yet. Its not as if I have hundreds of dead bees, a dead queen etc.. all lying at enterance. The main thing is these bees are still doing OK by the looks of the entrance and underneath, apart from the chalkbrood that I would have got anyway with the apiguard so hopefully others can meet me at this drawn line and move on too.

Where I'm at now is I have 3 hives, 1 a caste which was building up OK, queen still laying few eggs in 1 cell last time I checked. I'm still feeding this hive and very soon going to put insulation over it. Reason why I haven't done already is because the measurements if box of insulation I've made up won't cover hive with feeder on because its just made to cover brood box, crown board and 2inch floor.

One of the lager colonies has super under with some honey, brood box with near full colony and brood box with a mixture of drawn wax frames to frames with foundation. This is getting treated with maq strip. I'm getting g conflicting information concerning the extra brood box because one, I'm getting told its to much empty space to heat and 2, I'm getting told not to go near hive which means not removing this box until spring so which one do I choose. Remember now that my insulation boxes are already made up for brood, super, floor, crown board. If I leave this brood in, is it wise to leave all that room over winter for the bees to heat. IMO, it would be best to set them back a day or 2 now rather than let them over winter in all this free space. Maybe im wrong and this space will OK over winter but by going by another members post in this thread, that doesnt sound to good. Sure I'll let jbm or if hes jumped ship for good, ill let yous decided on what to do next instead of me trying to guess what's best to do.

The other larger colony doesn't have super on but its like the bone above, its got the extra brood and insulation already made up ready to go on. Maybe I could put the insulation on now thou that's just going to leave gap at bottom. I'll put it on Fri when its time to feed thou I'll probably still have small gap because feeder will be on crown board.

 

[Davelin]

Think your right. Just looked at pics on net and looks like it but its like this, I would have got chalk brood anyway if i choose apiguard because I'd have had to open the hive more times to put apiguard in rather than just the once for maqs. So there's sweet FA I could have done about this.

Don't think it's necessarily related to the number of times you open the hive, but a strong colony can cope with it better.

Not the time to worry about it now, but assuming your colony survives the winter you can consider what to do next spring.

 

[Davelin]

For what it's worth I would take your extra brood box off now, brood plus super is plenty of room, two brood plus super is a lot of space to keep warm.

Feed them up as quickly as you can and shut them up for winter.

 

[irishguy]

Don't think it's necessarily related to the number of times you open the hive, but a strong colony can cope with it better.

Not the time to worry about it now, but assuming your colony survives the winter you can consider what to do next spring.

There was defo no chalkbrood when I last inspected so it might be that I was the cause of it but like you say no worrying about it now.

For what it's worth I would take your extra brood box off now, brood plus super is plenty of room, two brood plus super is a lot of space to keep warm.

Feed them up as quickly as you can and shut them up for winter.

Yeah I was thinking this. This is the smart move IMO but others mightn't agree but its what I'll be doing. I'll remove this in few days when temps have risen again because its quite cold here today.

Thanks for your input.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

ive made mistakes, jbm made mistake

It seems the only mistake I made was spending a lot of my time getting you out of a hole you got yourself into. You seem to be well content with demanding advice from everyone, then picking and choosing what you want then blaming everyone but yourself when things go a little bit shaky.

I'll go back to a statement I made way back when this thread was but a couple of pages old.

Poor Bees​

 

[irishguy]

...

 

[Davelin]

Shame you have to resort to this after all the efforts people, especially jbm have made to help you.

I won't be offering you any more advice.