what to plant to outcompete grass

[Greggorio]

I am new to beekeeping but I have some wasteground on the margins of our field that borders our marsh. I want to plant things good for bees but that I will not need to weed around. I'm assuming some types of mint would be good and I assume outcompete. We have masses of foxgloves all over the place but I need other suggestions to get them established this year ready for next year.

Any ideas?

Thanks

 

[JEP]

There is not usually much point in planting specifically for your own bees. Unless you plant hundreds of acres of flowers you are not likely to provide even 1% of what they will forage on. However if you have a wood burner then you could for instance plant a number of fast growing willow hybrids for firewood coppicing. These do very well on marshy land and provide a good nectar and pollen source early in the year when not much else is in flower.

 

[thenovice]

I am new to beekeeping but I have some wasteground on the margins of our field that borders our marsh. I want to plant things good for bees but that I will not need to weed around. I'm assuming some types of mint would be good and I assume outcompete. We have masses of foxgloves all over the place but I need other suggestions to get them established this year ready for next year.

Any ideas?

Thanks

Plant nothing, mow twice a year and take away cuttings to deplete soil of nutrients. you should get a very nice meadow soon...

 

[B+.]

Any ideas?

lemon balm smells nice and forms tight clumps. It may take a while to overpower grass though

 

[charlievictorbravo]

Yellow Rattle a is semi-parasitic wild flower and will in time reduce the density and size of grass. Then you can seed whatever takes your fancy in the knowledge that the seedlings of chosen plants have a chance to compete with the grass.

CVB

 

[beecology]

Plant nothing, mow twice a year and take away cuttings to deplete soil of nutrients. you should get a very nice meadow soon...

Its hard to prescribe the best management without assessing a site but, assuming there are no rarities present, the above suggestion is a very good starting place to increasing floristic diversity and reducing the dominance of some grasses.

It always worries me when people label sites as waste ground - often very nice habitats

 

[Russel]

Its hard to prescribe the best management without assessing a site but, assuming there are no rarities present, the above suggestion is a very good starting place to increasing floristic diversity and reducing the dominance of some grasses.

It always worries me when people label sites as waste ground - often very nice habitats

Wildflowers do much better on "waste ground" than on land that have been mown regularly, as they have little nutriants from no grass cutting.
You may have noticed councils are mowing less often and planting wildflowers along some principle roads,parks etc, in the belief that they will automatically provived frorage and habitat for pollinators. You may also have observed that grass's are the most dominant plant in these areas unless they have totally removed the grass first it will be some time before wildflowers take over as they can't compete with grass in nutriant rice areas.
If you been using fertilizers this will take some time to wash out.

Interestingly my wife mows our and a neighbours lawns fortnightly, sooner if poss she likes gardening or mowing(?), to keep the grass at bay but not too low to take the heads off all the clovers, buttercups and daisies and those that are cut seem to recover within 2 to 3 days, which goes against the councils management regime?.

 

[Ah-Muzen-Cab]

aren't some wild flowers types of grasses?

 

[greengumbo]

Yellow rattle is a great little plant. Bumble bees love it and it seeds readily and parasitizing grass. I have planted verges all around our area with seeds and after a year you can really see the difference as if cuts back the grass. Then plant other wild stuff - poppies, corn flowers, ox eye daisies.

 

[Erichalfbee]

Yellow rattle will sort it.
PS
It will parasitise clover if it runs out of grass. Mowing the area before it sets seed will reduce it to manageable levels.
You have to sow it in the autumn as it needs a prolonged period of cold weather to enable germination in the spring

 

[Greggorio]

When I say wasteground, it used to be our veg plot which has been moved so is currently an assortment of weeds, potatoes and courgettes. I just meant it's waste in the sense it's of no use to us now. I can't mow it as it isn't flat enough. I can't plant yellow rattle as the rest of the field is cut for hay and is used as grazing for donkeys.

I just need spreading, flowering plants that grow at least as tall as grass (like mint).

Though someone has said there is no point as I'd needs hundreds of acres of flowers, though I have a 3 hectare (ish) cider orchard next to our house with 5500 trees which I'm pretty sure two hives would struggle to deal with on their own so I'm not sure on the maths of that statement but I am a beginner so you guys tell me if this is even worth bothering with or just leave this ground to return to whatever it wants

 

[Erichalfbee]

When I say wasteground, it used to be our veg plot which has been moved so is currently an assortment of weeds, potatoes and courgettes. I just meant it's waste in the sense it's of no use to us now. I can't mow it as it isn't flat enough. I can't plant yellow rattle as the rest of the field is cut for hay and is used as grazing for donkeys.

I just need spreading, flowering plants that grow at least as tall as grass (like mint).

Though someone has said there is no point as I'd needs hundreds of acres of flowers, though I have a 3 hectare (ish) cider orchard next to our house with 5500 trees which I'm pretty sure two hives would struggle to deal with on their own so I'm not sure on the maths of that statement but I am a beginner so you guys tell me if this is even worth bothering with or just leave this ground to return to whatever it wants

Let it go to bramble and rosebay? Plant old english Lavender?..mine stands nearly a metre tall. Evening Primrose? Californian Poppies?
Your apple trees are great but very seasonal

 

[YorkshireBees]

There is not usually much point in planting specifically for your own bees. Unless you plant hundreds of acres of flowers you are not likely to provide even 1% of what they will forage on. However if you have a wood burner then you could for instance plant a number of fast growing willow hybrids for firewood coppicing. These do very well on marshy land and provide a good nectar and pollen source early in the year when not much else is in flower.

I'm sorry but if everyone took this attitude we would have a lot less forage!

I'm of the camp that every little bit helps!

Plant nothing, mow twice a year and take away cuttings to deplete soil of nutrients. you should get a very nice meadow soon...

I have effectively done this with my back lawn (loose term) for 3 years and the plants / flowers that have come up have a) amazed me b) Changed each year so far.
The first year a lot of yellow meadow vetch seemed to cloak everything but at least it kept the grass down, then now there are more daisies, clover and other flowers that I haven't yet identified.

I also find aswell as pollinators bees of all kinds loving it that the birds come to hunt insects in the tall grass / plants!

Attached is a photo I have just taken although it's not a sunny day and it is kind of between flowering atm!

 

[JEP]

When saying there is little point planting specifically for bees I mean that whatever you plant on a small area of land is not going to materially improve your honey crop. Remember that your bees will forage over all the land in at least a 1 mile radius and at certain times of the year much more than that. So I wouldn't go out of my way to plant specifically for bees if there were other plants or trees that might be preferable for either aesthetic or economic reasons.

 

[Greggorio]

When saying there is little point planting specifically for bees I mean that whatever you plant on a small area of land is not going to materially improve your honey crop. Remember that your bees will forage over all the land in at least a 1 mile radius and at certain times of the year much more than that. So I wouldn't go out of my way to plant specifically for bees if there were other plants or trees that might be preferable for either aesthetic or economic reasons.

It's hard to describe our land easily but the field is on the other side of a lane to our house so we can't see it out the window and the apiary and ground in question are in the far corner so aesthetics are irrelevant (that's why the veg plot was there because it was bloody ugly with me left in charge of it)
Economic reasons it's just going to be left untouched from now on so ideally something the bees like is preferable. I'm less worried about it improving the honey crop for me and more that it provides food for the bees. I'm not even that excited by honey, I just find bees fascinating.

The worst thing is the sheer volume of oilseed rape fields they have over here. The nearest one will be 4-500m away which may be good for the bees but I've read it's a bugger to get out of the comb

Also the entire 2 acre field we have cut for hay is left to do as it likes before it is cut and then again afterwards so it has flowers and other things in there. We have masses of blackberry hedgerows, blackthorn in spring. The cider orchard etc etc. I suppose I was hoping for a bunch of suggestions and then I'd google and see which flower longest, earliest and latest and choose from those 3 for greatest benefit.

 

[REDWOOD]

clover

 

[wessexmario]

I'm sorry but if everyone took this attitude we would have a lot less forage!

I'm of the camp that every little bit helps!

I have effectively done this with my back lawn (loose term) for 3 years and the plants / flowers that have come up have a) amazed me b) Changed each year so far.

My front garden looks like that
The other half thinks it should look like a billiard table but the dice falls with who will use the lawnmower (or more correctly in our house, who doesn't).

 

[Amari]

I am new to beekeeping but I have some wasteground on the margins of our field that borders our marsh. I want to plant things good for bees but that I will not need to weed around. I'm assuming some types of mint would be good and I assume outcompete. We have masses of foxgloves all over the place but I need other suggestions to get them established this year ready for next year.
Any ideas?
Thanks

Borage receives many peoples' vote as the most bee-attractive plant - and of course is also grown in fields commercially. I have a borage patch on my allotment and usually the flowers attract more honey bees than bumbles - the opposite of many other species. I do not sow anew because it self-seeds and seedlings survive the winter and bloom in late spring while other seeds germinate to bloom mid to late summer. I am unsure whether seed sown into grass would get established.

 

[Fatbee]

Bees love OSR so if there is a lot grown near you they will be in it if you like it or night - they may even fly over your flowering apple orchard to get to it!

But good on you for trying - I have to say the weed type of plants seem to be well liked such as bramble and Willowherb

 

[Fatbee]

Further thought plant something that flowers between flows (so once OSR goes over) and or after main flow - best to have some plants when there are gaps