Uniting colonies with supers

[LeaBees]

Hi and apologies if already spelt out, but any advice on how to unite Q- and Q+ colonies that both have more than 1 super on and busy.

Add the Q- broodbox above the supers on the Q+ colony? And leave Q- supers on Q- brood box? Where does the paper separator go?

Leave for how long?

Thanks

 

[Erichalfbee]

Newspaper between the colonies, so over the Q+ colony and under the Q-
I consolidate as soon as I see a decent amount of newspaper under the hive

 

[BeeKeyPlayer]

I asked myself this question just yesterday and came to the same conclusion. One of the great things about this forum, info just when you need it.

 

[Sutty]

I've usually united the brood boxes and put the supers on top though this seems a minority approach. I use air freshener though.
I'm curious about some aspects of these unites. If you Demaree you separate 2 brood areas by eg 2 supers and expect them to make QCs, but you unite separated by 2 supers and expect them not to.
Seems a bit contradictory!

 

[Michael Palmer]

Well, I usually do things a bit differently.
I would remove the Q+ colony from its bottom. Place the Q- on the bottom. Paper. Q+ on paper. Q+ super on.
Bees in Q- super are banged out into the lid and the super is added to hive. Q- bees dumped out front.
Why? Q+ retains its field force. Q+ colony is on top, isolated from any commotion by lost bees.
Q+ field bees go down past Q- bees to leave hive...not the other way around.

 

[ericbeaumont]

Add the Q- broodbox above the supers on the Q+ colony? And leave Q- supers on Q- brood box? Where does the paper separator go?

As long as different colony elements are separated by paper, you can do it any way you want, but I prefer to unite the BBs below and supers on top, to limit the period of deviation from a standard layout.

Reason I put the Q+BB on the floor: Q+foragers return to Q+colony without risk of fighting; during a flow bees will tolerate all sorts of moves, but outside a flow, Q+foragers to Q-BB might lead to fighting.

Leave for how long?

This:

consolidate as soon as I see a decent amount of newspaper under the hive

 

[The Poot]

As long as different colony elements are separated by paper, you can do it any way you want, but I prefer to unite the BBs below and supers on top, to limit the period of deviation from a standard layout.

Reason I put the Q+BB on the floor: Q+foragers return to Q+colony without risk of fighting; during a flow bees will tolerate all sorts of moves, but outside a flow, Q+foragers to Q-BB might lead to fighting.


This:

I may be having to do this, so to be clear, you would use paper between the two sets of supers as well as between the broods?
Alternatively, I guess the supers could be transferred to other hives - and I think I’ve read on here that you don’t need to remove the bees at all if doing so? (Or did I dream that?)

 

[ericbeaumont]

use paper between the two sets of supers as well as between the broods?

Any box that differs gets a sheet of paper.

Alternatively, I guess

Guessing takes energy; instead, spend energy and gain certainty by putting a sheet down between each differing box.

 

[Swarm]

I may be having to do this, so to be clear, you would use paper between the two sets of supers as well as between the broods?
Alternatively, I guess the supers could be transferred to other hives - and I think I’ve read on here that you don’t need to remove the bees at all if doing so? (Or did I dream that?)

Transferring supers to other colonies is ok.

 

[Erichalfbee]

Transferring supers to other colonies is ok.

So you could park supers for a few days then put them back after consolidating the unites?

 

[Beth]

I did Q+ nuc on top of Q- BB and their super, no problem.

 

[The Poot]

So you could park supers for a few days then put them back after consolidating the unites?

Yes, that’s what I was thinking.

 

[Erichalfbee]

I did Q+ nuc on top of Q- BB and their super, no problem.

Yes that’s no problem but what to do if both colonies have supers?

 

[Sutty]

I have heard that super bees don't fight.
A commercial beek I get equipment from said he sometimes exchanges the position of the brood boxes between 2 hives but puts the supers back on the hive at their original location.

 

[LeaBees]

Any box that differs gets a sheet of paper.


Guessing takes energy; instead, spend energy and gain certainty by putting a sheet down between each differing box.

Thanks, so if I read it right I could do - from left to right;

Q+ bb, QE, Q+ super(s), paper, Q- bb, Q- super(s)

or

Q+ bb, paper, QE, Q- bb, paper, ALL supers ?

 

[ericbeaumont]

think I’ve read on here

have heard that super bees don't fight

Hearsay is not much use when someone else's short-cut doesn't work out for you.

Q+ bb, paper, QE, Q- bb, paper, ALL supers

If you've paid for a newspaper, why not use a few sheets more, separate the different supers and eliminate risk?

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

I'm curious about some aspects of these unites. If you Demaree you separate 2 brood areas by eg 2 supers and expect them to make QCs, but you unite separated by 2 supers and expect them not to.
Seems a bit contradictory!

not really - in Demaree you are separating the nurse bees and brood from the queen so they don't get a full pheromone blast and think she is failing thus start making supersedure cells (and why two supers?) but often don't make QC's, in fact this year I think it's been less than 50%
There isn't a separation during an unite - the clue is in the word.

 

[Sutty]

not really - in Demaree you are separating the nurse bees and brood from the queen so they don't get a full pheromone blast and think she is failing thus start making supersedure cells (and why two supers?) but often don't make QC's, in fact this year I think it's been less than 50%
There isn't a separation during an unite - the clue is in the word.

Whereas in a unite over supers, assuming one nest has just been made queenless, you also have nurse bees separated from the queen, so you would expect them not to get the "full pheromone blast" either.