Trails and Tribulations of extracting. Advice please

[WoodenBeam]

Now, just to throw a spanner in the works - you know the statement ask an easy question and inevitably you'll get more than one answer
I would extract what you could as already stated but then score any cappings over crystallised honey, spray with water and then place said super under the brood box - you'll find they will move it a lot easier (no queen ex in between, could even stay like this until spring).
Certainly for cleaning wet supers following extraction I place over an crown board on top but for your situation no.

 

[Erichalfbee]

It's called a supers heater trolley. Very multi-functional piece of kit.

It looks great. I bet it's expensive.....sigh

 

[enrico]

[QUOTEQUOTE]

Sorry guys back to the original question, I wont be able to get the Super Heater at this time, OH is going to build a solar extractor so will add warming cabinet to his to-do list.

Enrico's suggestion makes sense, can I just clarify; starting at the bottom broodbox, QE, super, crown board with hole, empty super with no frames in?, super with the unextracted honey in,roof.[/QUOTE]

Yep, that is correct order. Empty super not essential but stops them back filling the super you are trying to empty. An eke will do if you have one. They will clean it in a couple of days. You may need to put bee escape on to clear the bees when it is empty. Best to put it on in the evening as that deters robbers.
Best of luck
E

 

[maddydog]

It looks great. I bet it's expensive.....sigh

£280

I've converted the underside of a large bee equipment storage unit into a warming cabinet using ply, kingspan, oil filled radiator and a large fan coupled to an stc1000. I could probably fit 6 supers and a couple of buckets in. If I had grandchildren they'd be in it too

 

[linoleum bonypart]

I hate scruffy looking kit and spend my honey money on good quality equipment.
If most are doing everything on the cheap what do you spend your excess honey on? Or am I missing something.

A fridge looks like a fridge.... dont use a scruffy one lol

 

[Erichalfbee]

£280

I've converted the underside of a large bee equipment storage unit into a warming cabinet using ply, kingspan, oil filled radiator and a large fan coupled to an stc1000. I could probably fit 6 supers and a couple of buckets in. If I had grandchildren they'd be in it too

Self Christmas present
Does anybody have a link?
Ah..... got it. Abelo

 

[peacoops]

Ok so which hives are most deserving, ie who would it benefit most the ones it came off or would it boost the swarm hives? All in same apiary (my garden). I suppose I am asking if it is more work for the bees to make stores from foraging or to move it down?
And the cappings what would you put them in for a clean up?

 

[Erichalfbee]

Ok so which hives are most deserving, ie who would it benefit most the ones it came off or would it boost the swarm hives? All in same apiary (my garden). I suppose I am asking if it is more work for the bees to make stores from foraging or to move it down?
And the cappings what would you put them in for a clean up?

Much easier to move down or up

Cappings? Drain properly or spin then put in a miller feeder up top

 

[Curley]

It's called a supers heater trolley. Very multi-functional piece of kit.

Thanks for that Beefriendy - a really useful post - quick question if I may?
I've basically made my own one of these (bar the wheels) - an old super with heaters and fan in there controlled by an STC1000 , all under a strong grill. Add empty supers/broods above with an insulated lid with a port for the dangely temperature probe and hey presto! its a warming cabinet.
I have thought of using it as a warmer for crystallized honey still in the comb(in a super ) but worried about how soft the wax would get as most of my OSR honey has to be warmed north of 40 Celsius before its mobile. What temperature have you used to warm crystallized honey and did the comb stand up to the extraction or was extra care needed?

Cheers

 

[Beefriendly]

Thanks for that Beefriendy - a really useful post - quick question if I may?
I've basically made my own one of these (bar the wheels) - an old super with heaters and fan in there controlled by an STC1000 , all under a strong grill. Add empty supers/broods above with an insulated lid with a port for the dangely temperature probe and hey presto! its a warming cabinet.
I have thought of using it as a warmer for crystallized honey still in the comb(in a super ) but worried about how soft the wax would get as most of my OSR honey has to be warmed north of 40 Celsius before its mobile. What temperature have you used to warm crystallized honey and did the comb stand up to the extraction or was extra care needed?

Cheers

Rape honey is your problem here as it seems to require around 50oC. I have little experience of decrystallizing rape honey in the comb to spin out later. In the past I've melted and crushed the honey out, losing the frames. But I know of people who have done this, so it will work for rape honey. I'm fortunate that in using poly hives Heat retention) I only ever get an occasional cell that has crytallized. With the later summer blossom honeys and brood frames they seem to liquify much easier....around 40-45. The wax comb does get soft and you do occasionally get an odd collapse, but in general seems to work fine.
I use it more as dehumidifier for drying uncapped honey, worth it's weight in gold when your capped heather honey is showing 25% water..

Recommend you put thermostat at the top of the first super not at the top of the stack, otherwise you will overheat and melt your bottom combs.

 

[Poly Hive]

Does anyone have a link please as could be a very useful bit of kit for the Assoc.

PH

 

[Erichalfbee]

Does anyone have a link please as could be a very useful bit of kit for the Assoc.

PH

https://www.abelo.co.uk/shop/warming-honey/supers-heater-trolley/

 

[Erichalfbee]

I use it more as dehumidifier for drying uncapped honey, worth it's weight in gold when your capped heather honey is showing 25%

I'm really intrigued
It has taken me 3 days to get 4 supers down from 20% to 17% and the grandchildrens bedroom has been a no go zone. Will this machine take a few supers and can you just turn it on and leave it running in a corner somewhere?
Please

 

[maddydog]

Thanks for that Beefriendy - a really useful post - quick question if I may?
I've basically made my own one of these (bar the wheels) - an old super with heaters and fan in there controlled by an STC1000 , all under a strong grill. Add empty supers/broods above with an insulated lid with a port for the dangely temperature probe and hey presto! its a warming cabinet.
I have thought of using it as a warmer for crystallized honey still in the comb(in a super ) but worried about how soft the wax would get as most of my OSR honey has to be warmed north of 40 Celsius before its mobile. What temperature have you used to warm crystallized honey and did the comb stand up to the extraction or was extra care needed?

Cheers

Don't wish to be a doom-monger but expect to see puddles of honey and sagged wax. Otherwise, the dreaded death rattle as a frame blows in your extractor!

OSR is a blessing and a curse.

 

[Curley]

The wax comb does get soft and you do occasionally get an odd collapse, but in general seems to work fine.

.

Thanks Beefriendly and Maddydog. As I feared - going up to temperatures required for OSR isn't going to be viable. Ah well . Still - great for a space saving honey warmer and worth trying in the drying mode.

 

[Beefriendly]

I'm really intrigued
It has taken me 3 days to get 4 supers down from 20% to 17% and the grandchildrens bedroom has been a no go zone. Will this machine take a few supers and can you just turn it on and leave it running in a corner somewhere?
Please

I've only had mine about a year or so, so not fully explored all the possibilities, but I put 4 supers of not quite ripe heather honey on it and it dried them down nicely in a few days. Basically put in corner and let it get on with it. Was advised to stick the thermostat (which is on a clip and cable) to the top of first super. If you stick right at top it overheats the bottom ones.
I've used it to remelt some crystallized heather honey in the comb at 45oC without any problems.
The footprint is dadant but it seats National and Langsrioth quite well.
Temp control is from 30-80oC so can be used for melting wax at a pinch. It's basically two fans blowing onto a central heated plate which gives a steady draft of warm air upwards though a stainless steel mesh. Any thing that drops into it lands on a cleanable easily reached plate, or the bottom floor is removable (slides out).
I was intending to put a couple of brood boxes and bucket of set honey inside and use it to melt it....but I now have another piece of kit for doing that.

Worth it's weight in gold in spring when I'm spinning out old brood frames full of stores as it warms them up nicely to a temperature you can spin them out. Otherwise it's so cold in my extraction area that they honey just stays put in the frame.
I'm sure it would be easy enough to cobble something similar together for much less money...but what the hell, it looks good and is all stainless steel.

 

[Beefriendly]

Thanks Beefriendly and Maddydog. As I feared - going up to temperatures required for OSR isn't going to be viable.

Yes it is, you need to try these things before giving up. Yes you may have an odd frame sag or blow, but these things happen anyway. Set it off at 45 and see how it goes, increase temperatures in 1oC increments. The 50oC is more to do with rape in set in a bucket where you have a small surface area being heated and a large volume to fully liquefy. In a comb you have a large surface area and small volume and will probably not require as high a temperature.
In fact you don't have to get it fully melted...just runny enough to extract. Easier to fully melt any crystals after extraction.

 

[Erichalfbee]

I've only had mine about a year or so, so not fully explored all the possibilities
I'm sure it would be easy enough to cobble something similar together for much less money...but what the hell, it looks good and is all stainless steel.

Thanks ...great info

 

[peacoops]

Now, just to throw a spanner in the works - you know the statement ask an easy question and inevitably you'll get more than one answer
I would extract what you could as already stated but then score any cappings over crystallised honey, spray with water and then place said super under the brood box - you'll find they will move it a lot easier (no queen ex in between, could even stay like this until spring).
Certainly for cleaning wet supers following extraction I place over an crown board on top but for your situation no.

Thanks everyone.
I think i am going to try one as per Enrico and one as per WoodenBeam. My plan is to nadir under the swarm hive with the least stores, put the other over the hive it came from. And the cappings that contain all the set honey I'll put over another of the swarm hives, I just have to get a miller feeder as I only have the round rapid feeders....
Unless anyone see's a major flaw in this plan?

 

[Bee Bumble]

Rape honey is your problem here as it seems to require around 50oC. I have little experience of decrystallizing rape honey in the comb to spin out later. In the past I've melted and crushed the honey out, losing the frames. But I know of people who have done this, so it will work for rape honey. I'm fortunate that in using poly hives Heat retention) I only ever get an occasional cell that has crytallized. With the later summer blossom honeys and brood frames they seem to liquify much easier....around 40-45. The wax comb does get soft and you do occasionally get an odd collapse, but in general seems to work fine.
I use it more as dehumidifier for drying uncapped honey, worth it's weight in gold when your capped heather honey is showing 25% water..

Recommend you put thermostat at the top of the first super not at the top of the stack, otherwise you will overheat and melt your bottom combs.

On one occasion, I set mine at 43 with 6 supers on overnight and the thermostat at the top of the first super. The top 3 supers were fine but some frames at the bottom had collapsed. I think the problem arises when the bees draw out the wax more on one side than the other. As the wax softens the extra weight on one side causes the collapse.
I now go through the box and any frames that are much heavier one side are removed before the super goes on the heater trolley.