Total wasp out

[Lyra]

Having been away for 4 days I have returned to find that a healthy hive has been decimated by wasps. Having just inspected there are no stores, a few hundred workers, a few drones and not much else. Certainly n queen.

I had already closed down the entrance and set wasp traps. Yes, the traps are full of dead wasps as well.

I welcome any suggestions. As it is this hive won’t las the winter, even if it lives on feed.

 

[Amari]

Having been away for 4 days I have returned to find that a healthy hive has been decimated by wasps. Having just inspected there are no stores, a few hundred workers, a few drones and not much else. Certainly n queen.

I had already closed down the entrance and set wasp traps. Yes, the traps are full of dead wasps as well.

I welcome any suggestions. As it is this hive won’t las the winter, even if it lives on feed.

Condolences Lyra, was it your only colony and when did you last inspect it? I agree, the colony is doomed so probably best to close it or shake it out. It's unusual for a strong healthy colony to be decimated in the few days you were away so was the hive entrance wide open or were the wasps entering though a gap in the woodwork or maybe the colony was weaker than you thought - starvation, varroa, loss of queen etc.
Next year, as well as closing the entrance down to little more than one bee space in the wasp season there are many additional suggestions on the forum to reduce the risk: eg. under-floor entrances and various tunnel gadgets to attach on or insert into the hive entrance.

 

[Karol]

Sorry to hear of your predicament.

I was about to post a heads up that the wasp season is about to turn. There is a loose correlation between ants swarming and wasp nest maturation when wasps switch from protein feeding to carbohydrate feeding. Sunday night I came across an ant nest preparing to swarm and today there have been clouds of swarming ants. Upshot being that it would be prudent for beekeepers to be a little more vigilant for signs of wasp attack.

Whilst wasps will usually tease out weaker and diseased hives this isn't always the case and even strong hives can succumb to persistent wasp pressure especially if it becomes pheromone driven frenzied feeding.

 

[ericbeaumont]

a healthy hive has been decimated

unusual for a strong healthy colony to be decimated

Sorry to hear the bad news, Lyra.

Difficult at this distance to know the full story, but the health of a colony is no guarantee that it will repel a wasp attack. It is, rather, the strength of a healthy colony that will enable it to survive.

A strong colony is one that is rammed full of bees, likely on double brood and a few supers full of bees. As a novice beekeeper you may not be aware of the distinction between a colony that ticks over and one which is strong. It is also common to find that newer beekeepers prefer smaller colonies because they appear more manageable.

Are you certain that the queen is absent? Do not assume that because there are no eggs that there is no queen: she may be off-lay because of the disruption and a lack of feeding. You have nothing to lose by getting on the phone and finding a temporary site 3 miles away: a friend's garden, school grounds, a corner of a field.

If you have a nuc box, transfer the best 6 combs and bees into it during the day and leave it with a very restricted entrance on the same spot as the hive until evening; remove the hive and put it in a place where no wasp can smell or reach it. If the nuc is unmolested at the new site, feed regularly late in the day and check for eggs after a few days.

Don't let disaster put you off starting again in spring, and when you do, aim to run two strong colonies next year, rather than one: you're less likely to lose both, in winter or summer, and can split the survivor to replace a loss.

 

[Karol]

Sorry to hear the bad news, Lyra.

Difficult at this distance to know the full story, but the health of a colony is no guarantee that it will repel a wasp attack. It is, rather, the strength of a healthy colony that will enable it to survive.

A strong colony is one that is rammed full of bees, likely on double brood and a few supers full of bees. As a novice beekeeper you may not be aware of the distinction between a colony that ticks over and one which is strong. It is also common to find that newer beekeepers prefer smaller colonies because they appear more manageable.

Are you certain that the queen is absent? Do not assume that because there are no eggs that there is no queen: she may be off-lay because of the disruption and a lack of feeding. You have nothing to lose by getting on the phone and finding a temporary site 3 miles away: a friend's garden, school grounds, a corner of a field.

If you have a nuc box, transfer the best 6 combs and bees into it during the day and leave it with a very restricted entrance on the same spot as the hive until evening; remove the hive and put it in a place where no wasp can smell or reach it. If the nuc is unmolested at the new site, feed regularly late in the day and check for eggs after a few days.

Don't let disaster put you off starting again in spring, and when you do, aim to run two strong colonies next year, rather than one: you're less likely to lose both, in winter or summer, and can split the survivor to replace a loss.

All sound advice save for one little but important detail. If the hive is coated in wasp distress pheromone because it has succumbed to frenzied wasp attack moving it any distance without first inactivating the pheromones is unlikely to work. The hive will be detected and subjected to further wasp attack regardless of how far away it is moved. Distress pheromone can be inactivated using a soda wash followed by a water rinse. Alternatively transfer everything into a fresh hive, move the new hive and leave the old hive in its place and set wasp traps.

 

[Erichalfbee]

Hell..... @Lyra
Is that your only colony?
If you fancy a drive over to West Wales you can have one of mine for nothing to replace it.

All my colonies are really strong and I've seen only a few wasps when I've had hives open.
Had to make a nuc up to accommodate a new queen that I had panned to re queen an existing colony. It's a Maisie's nuc on a solid UFE floor. Wasps were straight there out of nowhere. Closed the entrance down and they were coping but still having to fight off wasps so put on a conduit entrance curtesy of @enrico
Works a treat.

 

[ericbeaumont]

the traps are full of dead wasps

set wasp traps

Where would traps best be set, Karol?

I've never used traps, but believed that putting them in an apiary attracted wasps. Better further out?

 

[Erichalfbee]

If you've had a wipeout put a trap where the hive was

 

[Lyra]

Condolences Lyra, was it your only colony and when did you last inspect it? I agree, the colony is doomed so probably best to close it or shake it out. It's unusual for a strong healthy colony to be decimated in the few days you were away so was the hive entrance wide open or were the wasps entering though a gap in the woodwork or maybe the colony was weaker than you thought - starvation, varroa, loss of queen etc.
Next year, as well as closing the entrance down to little more than one bee space in the wasp season there are many additional suggestions on the forum to reduce the risk: eg. under-floor entrances and various tunnel gadgets to attach on or insert into the hive entrance.

Thank you for your reply. I agree that the colony is doomed. I will start again. Do you suggest I wait for next year or get a nuc and feed it up?

 

[ericbeaumont]

the colony is doomed

Not unless you're certain there is no queen (and I don't think you are) so move it today and give it a chance to prove status one way or the other.

wait for next year or get a nuc

Over-wintered nucs fetch best prices and are in demand to replace winter losses, whereas your local BKA will have members with spares now at reasonable cost.

However, there's no point in giving your wasps a second course unless the nuc is very strong. Feeding is a no-no, as wasps pick up on sugar very quickly. Even if it were strong, perhaps better to buy it and delay collection until later in the year, when wasp attack will have declined.

Dani's offer is good and generous and worth the petrol.

 

[roche]

It feels like an unusually bad wasp year, and they seem to have changed to card feeding earlier than normal.

 

[Karol]

Where would traps best be set, Karol?

I've never used traps, but believed that putting them in an apiary attracted wasps. Better further out?

Yes and no.

Yes, low efficiency traps draw wasps into an apiary and shouldn't be used because they serve to make the problem worse. Efficiency is not determined by how many wasps a trap catches. Low efficiency traps will always kill more wasps than high efficiency traps because they constantly recruit more wasps into the area because the location of the trap is communicated to wasp nests by escaping returning foragers.

No, high efficiency traps that kill 100% of the wasps they catch can be safely placed in apiaries because the location of the trap does not get communicated back to the nest. So the trap eradicates wasps in the vicinity to be protected reducing pressure on the hives but doesn't kill as many wasps because it only eradicates wasps that naturally come to the hives anyway.

There is more to it in terms of wasp feeding behaviour but that would result in a long missive.

 

[ericbeaumont]

long missive.

I'll put the kettle on.

 

[Sutty]

Happy to read a long missive - sounds of interest!

 

[steve1958]

At present wasps are going to my traps that have protein bait, but ignoring the traps with sugar, fruit, or beer in.

 

[Gilberdyke John]

At present wasps are going to my traps that have protein bait, but ignoring the traps with sugar, fruit, or beer in.

There seems to be some overlap of feeding patterns at present. I've got interest in jam/sugary traps plus remnants of a mouse the cat left are being dissected by wasps.

 

[Amari]

At present wasps are going to my traps that have protein bait, but ignoring the traps with sugar, fruit, or beer in.

What protein bait d'you use?

 

[Suffolkway]

Karol, have you an example of a 'high efficiency trap' please?

 

[Erichalfbee]

Karol, have you an example of a 'high efficiency trap' please?

Wasp bane. Look it up on Google. There us a section in the website dedicated to beekeeping. Also do a search for wasps posted by Karol. There is lots.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

These work a treat, swmbo spent hours every day during lockdown summer watching wasps enter her trap, not one escaped all summer cheap enough on amazoon