swarming or supercedure

[thenovice]

I saw a queen cell with an egg in this weekend so checked how they got on with it yesterday. I found 2 charged QC, elongated but not capped. 1 was on the face of the comb and 1 on the side. there were no further charged cups. the colony is a hived swarm from about 2 months ago. they have drawn 11 14x12 frames and have a super of undrawn frames. The queen is laying like a machine hence my doubts it is supercedure. I destroyed 1 QC by being too eager to look inside.

what would be the best mode of action: AS or leave them be?

 

[masterBK]

Swarms often supersede the queen several weeks or months after being hived. It is a logical thing for them to do as with prime swarms the queen could be old and the colony has more chance of survival though winter with a younger one. You could leave them get on with it or you could take the queen out in a small nucleus when the cells are sealed as a sort of insurance policy just in case new queen gets lost on orientation or mating flights or doesn't get mated properly. An alternative action is to take out a mating nucleus with one of the cells as insurance as well as a choice of queen if both get mated. There is a small chance they might swarm when 1st cell sealed as this does happen with swarmy strains but I doubt it in this case with the information you have provided. Maybe you could also clip the queen

 

[thenovice]

Swarms often supersede the queen several weeks or months after being hived. It is a logical thing for them to do as with prime swarms the queen could be old and the colony has more chance of survival though winter with a younger one. You could leave them get on with it or you could take the queen out in a small nucleus when the cells are sealed as a sort of insurance policy just in case new queen gets lost on orientation or mating flights or doesn't get mated properly. An alternative action is to take out a mating nucleus with one of the cells as insurance as well as a choice of queen if both get mated. There is a small chance they might swarm when 1st cell sealed as this does happen with swarmy strains but I doubt it in this case with the information you have provided. Maybe you could also clip the queen

if it is supercedure, they would not kill the old queen straight away no? wouldn't she be allowed to keep on going alongside the new queen untill her laying gets erratic and her pheromone wears out?

I think i will take my chances with this one. have way to many hives this year as it is. if she swarms they will most likely fill up the few spare boxes I have left. seems like the theme this year, leave equipment out and swarms take over before you have turned your back .

 

[Finman]

.
This time year of year I take all queen cells as swarm cells, what ever they are then.

I got a new mating Queen from Italy one month ago. I saw today Queen cells in the nuc.

I arrange that Queen and swarm cannot escape. Propably it is supercedure, but I do not take a risk. I start to rear queens in the hive and change the larvae.

.

 

[beeno]

Make up a nuc with the old queen. If new one does not work out they can have the old one back.

 

[masterBK]

Two types of supersedure
Inefficient (imperfect) supersedure is where the new queen emerges from her cell and kills her mother before mating and laying. This is inefficient because a gap in egg laying occurs
Efficient (perfect) supersedure is where the new queen emerges but her mother is not killed and continues to lay. The virgin will mate and she also lay. Eventually only the daughter queen will remain when her mother “disappears” presumably killed but this may be weeks or months later