swarm cells can't find unmarked queen

[topographic]

I have plenty of swarm cells and was going to move the existing queen and some frames, however i can't find her and two of us looked hard... she is there of that i am sure, eggs present etc. Any advice either on finding her or what to do if i can't.

Other than that i think eye tests may be needed!

 

[Ruth85]

Check your supers, i know sounds silly but could not find ours at last inspection and had lots of queen cells, however found her in the super today! she must have slimmed down for swarming, got thru the excluder and found room to lay and so stayed put! (she was on the centre frame in the super with lots of eggs and young larvae!)

 

[thurrock bees]

As you have stated that there are eggs, there is a good chance that she is there. there are two ways to find her...

1, when going thought the brood box, keep the frames in pairs with about 1 inch, once you reached the over side look at the frames that are in pairs. The queen perfers the dark so she SHOULD be on the frames facing each other.

2, using a spare brood box and floor, go thought the brood box and place the ' seen ' frames in the new b/box that way she cant run into the ' seen ' frames.

dont forget she could be thinner than normal if they are cutting down her food, getting her ready to fly/swarm.

 

[Flatters]

I had problems today and it took two inspections, the first doing a double pass of the frames to find her.

A slow systematic process we adopted. We always checked the dark face of the frames first. So when you produce a gap on inspecting the frame she is likely to have moved under to the dark side. So when you pull up the frame, check the dark side face first.

Is it possible she has already swarmed? Are the QC capped? If they are she may have upped and gone already.

 

[topographic]

too many bees, will have another look in a couple of days.

 

[Midland Beek]

Once queen cells start to be sealed the likelihood is that a swarm will leave, weather permitting. If you can't find the queen I would be inclined to split them anyway. After the split, she might be more findable, and any brood in with the queen can be put back into the queenless part. And if you are still unable to find her after the split, so be it ... you will probably lose a swarm.

 

[Joseph]

Relax and you will find her

 

[enrico]

Move the whole old hive to a new spot. Put the new hive on the old hive spot. Do your check on a calm hot day when bees are flying hard. They will start to return to the new hive leaving you less and less in the old hive. Have another spare brood and floor at the new site with the old hive and as you check each frame put it across to this spare brood. If you are sure she is there you will find her eventually. It can be time consuming. The way to check each frame is to lift a frame out check that side, lower your left hand and swing the frame though 90 degrees so it is upside down when you raise your left hand again! and then check the other side. On this check slightly tilt the frame The queen will try and go underneath so keep an eye on the edges, finally lower your left hand and repeat the process so that the frame is the right way up, once again checking from the edge inwards! She will try and hide in any hole she can find and will quickly go through a hole from one side of the frame to the other!!
I have just read all that and it sounds really complicated but if you need to find that queen then...... Actually I go with Midland and would split anyway! But up to you
E

 

[topographic]

happy ending/lucky ending

came home last night to find the swarm in my hedge. Now re-homed in new hive. Old hive working away as before.

 

[Chris B]

An alternative

Next time....

Move original hive aside and put new hive in it's place. Find a frame with a good queen cell on, brush off all bees and place into empty hive. Put QX and any supers onto empty hive. Destroy all Q cells in original hive.

I've used this technique 3 times already this season. First 2 worked, and the other it's too early to tell. Very useful if in a hurry or simply can't find the queen. BUT I only do it if I'm sure they've not yet swarmed.

 

[oliver90owner]

Weakening your swarming colony by removing most all the flying bees (you could move it again to keep it weak) will likely only delay that hive swarming. They will likely go again as the brood builds up, so it may be back in swarming mode in a very few weeks. Same problem then as now, just put off for a short while.

Regards, RAB