Super has been added but no interest

[Jake]

Hi guys
On my good hive I had to add a super last week as the brood box was full up and frames were heavy etc.
I check this fri and they haven't touched super at all the frames are foundation so they need to draw them out still any tips?
I'm thinking the flow has stopped now so they don't feel the need to use up energy etc
Or the queen excluder maybe stopping them it's only a cheap plastic version
Thamks
Jake

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

They'll go up if/when they need to and not before.

 

[kighill]

If you have a queen excluder in place try removing it for a few days (bees can be reluctant to go through a queen excluder until they get the hang of it.
Once they start drawing out the frames make sure the Queen is in the bottom box and replace the excluder.
If you do not have an excluder on then the previous advice works, just be patient.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Another beekeeping myth IMHO

 

[ShinySideUp]

I only use wired QE's but I have no scientific evidence to show these are better; the bees have no problems getting through.

 

[beeno]

Hi guys
On my good hive I had to add a super last week as the brood box was full up and frames were heavy etc.
I check this fri and they haven't touched super at all the frames are foundation so they need to draw them out still any tips?
I'm thinking the flow has stopped now so they don't feel the need to use up energy etc
Or the queen excluder maybe stopping them it's only a cheap plastic version
Thamks
Jake

Still a flow on. I had one colony the same as yours. Put a second brood box on and moved a frame with unsealed brood up with the nurse bees and a frame of foundation each side dummied down just above the brood nest. Added a frame of foundation each week and they have drawn out the brood box i.e. I am now using a brood box as a super with QX beneath. In another colony, I have also put a super frame into the brood box each week, to get it drawn out and moved it up into undrawn super. My only reason for doing this is an attempt to prevent swarming. However, only do this if weather is nice and warm.

 

[Jake]

I didn't know wether too
leave another week.
Remove queen excluder for a week
Put feeder on to help draw comb

 

[Angry_Mob]

If your brood box is strong leave them to it. Do not feed them as you'll end up with sugar syrup in your super frames; if you remove the excluder then you might end up with brood in your super.

 

[joelsoo]

If your brood box is strong leave them to it. Do not feed them as you'll end up with sugar syrup in your super frames; if you remove the excluder then you might end up with brood in your super.

I think kighill's idea of removing the excluder for few days is OK because then the bees are more inclined to go up without the excluder. However just keep a close eye and once they had drawn a little bit ofthe super frames, make sure queen is down below in main brood box, and put on the QE.

This way u won't get brood in your supers as they are only drawing out the super frames and not ready for queen to lay yet.

I put a super in my brood frame to cull drone brood as varroa control and at the same time once they drawn that super, I move the super to the top and swap for a new super frame with foundation at the bottom. I find the bees tend to be more inclined to draw out the remaining super this way if there is a head start super frame that is already drawn.

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[pargyle]

I think kighill's idea of removing the excluder for few days is OK because then the bees are more inclined to go up without the excluder. However just keep a close eye and once they had drawn a little bit ofthe super frames, make sure queen is down below in main brood box, and put on the QE.

This way u won't get brood in your supers as they are only drawing out the super frames and not ready for queen to lay yet.


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I wouldn't bank on it ... the queen will lay anywhere the committee decide she should lay ! If that's in a small section of new comb in a super then that's where she will lay.

I don't see that as a problem as I run all my hives without queen excluders but ... you should be aware that your plan may be flawed.

JBM has it right ... they will start to build out the super as and when they are ready ... regardless of whether there is a queen excluder in place.

Sometimes you just have to be a bit patient ... forcing bees to do anything is akin to herding cats ...

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

And before we hear the usual twaddle that they are reluctand to go up on foundation/the QX to start with.....
Only this season I had a strong colony, I put a queen excluder and fully drawn super on (stored wet from last season) The bees went up like a shot, cleaned out the super of any remaining honey, went back down to the 'bursting' brood box and didn't venture anywhere near the super for the next couple of weeks.
They will be getting their fourth super tomorrow.
The bees will go up when they're ready.
all this jiggery pokery with moving frames up and down, removing and replacing the QX is just a waste of your time and energy and is just sheer silliness.

 

[bingevader]

The bees will go up when they're ready.

And just to echo this from a different respective!
We haven't used QXs for a few years now and....

The bees will go up when they're ready.

and not before.

 

[Jake]

I'm going to leave for another week, I really don't think I will get any honey of them this Yr so they can have what ever they make for winter

 

[pargyle]

I'm going to leave for another week, I really don't think I will get any honey of them this Yr so they can have what ever they make for winter

Whoa ... the season is still in full swing, plenty of time yet but it depends on the forage around in the vicinity of your apiary. Have you looked around to see what is in flower ? A good long walk in ever increasing circles will give you some idea - take a note book and do it regularly, it will give you a really good idea of what to expect next year. In the meantime, you will be astounded at how quickly they will draw comb and fill it when there is a good source of nectar availablle.

Also in the meantime, concentrate on watching them come and go on the landing board. So much to learn just watching what they are doing there and what is coming in .. Keep an eye open for wasps on weaker hives, another week or two and the wasps will be moving from protein to sweet feeding and that's when you can get mass attacks on weaker hives.

If you are desperate for a taste of your own honey - take out one of the brood frame full of honey and crush and strain it .. you will get a good couple of pounds of honey out of a single brood frame - they will soon build out a new frame in the brood box and there's loads of time for them to build up for winter.

I rather think you may have put a super on the hive too soon .. how many frames of brood was there in the brood box when you added the super ? Too much space is as bad as too little space - beekeeping is a balancing act.

 

[Gilberdyke John]

And before we hear the usual twaddle that they are reluctand to go up on foundation/the QX to start with.....
Only this season I had a strong colony, I put a queen excluder and fully drawn super on (stored wet from last season) The bees went up like a shot, cleaned out the super of any remaining honey, went back down to the 'bursting' brood box and didn't venture anywhere near the super for the next couple of weeks.
They will be getting their fourth super tomorrow.
The bees will go up when they're ready.
all this jiggery pokery with moving frames up and down, removing and replacing the QX is just a waste of your time and energy and is just sheer silliness.

I know you've consistently maintained this approach Emyr but each to his/her own experiences. My first ever colony consistently refused to cross the excluder and start to draw comb on super foundation. They stuffed the brood box and swarmed into a nearby tree. Fortunately I caught and hived the swarm so apart from an early lesson in swarm catching things worked out.
The remaining bees still ignored the foundation. When the replacement queen started laying and the box was filling up with brood and nectar while still ignoring the super I took the excluder out in desperation. Within a few days they started drawing comb in the super.
Coincidence? Possibly but at no cost why take the risk? At the very worst a new beekeeper will gain a bit of familiarity with the bees.

 

[Jake]

Brood box is full up apart from one frame right at front of Hive, all frames feel very heavy queen still laying egg in old hatched capped cells

 

[pargyle]

Brood box is full up apart from one frame right at front of Hive, all frames feel very heavy queen still laying egg in old hatched capped cells

So .. are you saying that all your brood frames, except one, are full of honey or full of capped brood ..??

 

[Jake]

I feel like it's a mixture of everything the frames towards front and rear of Hive def seem more stores where as middle 5 or 5 frames are more eggs etc

 

[pargyle]

I feel like it's a mixture of everything the frames towards front and rear of Hive def seem more stores where as middle 5 or 5 frames are more eggs etc

That's what you should have .. frames of stores at the back of the box and sometimes at the front if your frames are warm way, brood on the frames in the middle of the hive often with a corollary of pollen and stored honey above and around the brood.

They are probably just coasting along .. usually they won't start on a super until there are enough bees to work it and sufficient forage and you may well find that, as the brood that is capped emerges, they will start to move up into the super. There may not be enough wax producing bees in the colony at present for them to get on an build more comb and they are waiting until the colony has grown a bit more.

In addition, some colonies are just plain lazy .. I have one that rarely fill more than one super - loads of bees in there and very healthy ... the colony next to them has three supers, two filled and capped and the third one well on the way. Yet, they look the smaller of the two colonies.

Sit tight, let them get on with it and see what happens.

 

[beeno]

I didn't know wether too
leave another week.
Remove queen excluder for a week
Put feeder on to help draw comb

Not expecting any more honey then? I am.