RSPCA & Bees

[Hachi]

Just watching a presentation by Celia F Davies "So you want to be a confident beekeeper" on the Ulster BKA YouTube channel.

Celia expresses her regret that the RSPCA is not involved with bees as part of the beek taking responsibility for the wellbeing of the bees as animals. The points she makes is round 11 minutes.

 

[MillMeadow]

The RSPCA has long forgotten its core role in my opinion and has instead become a lobbying group for issues removed from animal welfare.

 

[madasafish]

The last people you want near bees and beekeeping is the RSPCA.
Lots of nutter activists (lots of very committed people as well).

 

[Erichalfbee]

At branch level I found them dedicated and honest. Most went out of their way and spent a lot of their own time and money with animals needing their care. On a national level I found them wasteful, misguided and intransigent and stopped bothering with them

 

[Ian123]

Really can’t see any roll for them in beekeeping, or any reason why they would be involved.

 

[Nige.Coll]

I get Celia's point. She cares deeply about bees.
A lot of bees are lost either through neglect or ignorance.
If for instance, someone's cat, dog, horse, etc starved to death then that would raise questions. Yet thousands of bee colonies die each year, some aren't avoidable but a lot could easily be avoided with very little effort by the beekeeper.

I think that is the point she is trying to make and not that the RSPCA should be involved in beekeeping.
The same thing a lot have been saying for years, some people shouldn't be allowed to have bees.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Notwithstanding the grassroots workers, the RSPCA as an organisation became 'not fit for purpose' years ago, nothing but a political pressure group which should have lost its 'Royal' warrant long ago, and is just geared to make money.
Maybe Celia should take a step back and ask herself why is the BBKA not filling this gap when, to be honest they are part of the problem, not the solution.

 

[Ian123]

Whilst good practice and just general common sense are all that’s required I’m not sure how you distinguish between an abandoned hive and a wild colony, nature simply takes it course. As in general life Mother Nature can be far harsher than anything any beek will do!!

 

[user 20297]

Just watching a presentation by Celia F Davies "So you want to be a confident beekeeper" on the Ulster BKA YouTube channel.

Celia expresses her regret that the RSPCA is not involved with bees as part of the beek taking responsibility for the wellbeing of the bees as animals. The points she makes is round 11 minutes.

Maybe the RSPCA could get into policing other occurences of cruelty to insects.....people who use flyspray and waspkiller, gardeners who destroy greenfly, or maybe fishermen or reptile-keepers, who wantonly kill live maggots. Thinking more broadly, they might go after anglers or sea fishermen, and whilst they're at it, nab the chefs who boil lobsters alive.

 

[Hachi]

I get Celia's point. She cares deeply about bees.
A lot of bees are lost either through neglect or ignorance.
If for instance, someone's cat, dog, horse, etc starved to death then that would raise questions. Yet thousands of bee colonies die each year, some aren't avoidable but a lot could easily be avoided with very little effort by the beekeeper.

I think that is the point she is trying to make and not that the RSPCA should be involved in beekeeping.
The same thing a lot have been saying for years, some people shouldn't be allowed to have bees.

She's quite clear I think "....it's a pity the RSPCA don't get involved with bees...". I've taken the word "involved" to mean either training or prosecuting. As their role today involves what some would say is a disproportionate amount of prosecutions, many as private, I wonder if she means for beeks to be prosecuted for neglect and/or ignorance. Either way, I think the BBKA has skin in the game.....

 

[Firefly]

We have spent the entire 60+ years of my lifetime wreaking devastation on the entire invertebrate population of the planet, but the RSPCA should worry about the one species that actually has a dedicated group of people looking after it? Maybe beekeepers sometimes lack a little perspective?

 

[Nige.Coll]

She's quite clear I think "....it's a pity the RSPCA don't get involved with bees...". I've taken the word "involved" to mean either training or prosecuting. As their role today involves what some would say is a disproportionate amount of prosecutions, many as private, I wonder if she means for beeks to be prosecuted for neglect and/or ignorance. Either way, I think the BBKA has skin in the game.....

She doesn't generally mince her words and has a real low tolerance for fools.
It wouldn't be practical for the RSPCA to be involved in beekeeping for many reasons. But bees are the only animal people can keep and there are no consequences for neglect or ignorance other than financial loss. Is this right? well to people that care about bees no but to the general population they're just a buzzy pest that they like in a field and not nearby.
I get her point, but the RSPCA involved in bees is a bit ridiculous.
Normally a couple of years of total loss they suddenly become allergic and take up another hobby so it sorts itself in the end.

The BBKA cannot force people to do training and has no standard for training or tutors that its member associations have to abide by.
Any mug can start teaching beekeeping, I've seen people with 12 months of experience doing it who haven't a clue but deliver tripe with confidence. My wife drags me away from association stands at shows as the drivel spouted to the public by these experienced beekeepers generally gets a response they don't like.

Beekeeping is like a lot of other things in life, to the average person any rubbish delivered with confidence is accepted as the truth.

 

[blackcloud]

Horses had to be destroyed due to neglect and abuse at an RSPCA affiliated stable a while back.
Reinforced my opinion anyway

 

[Hachi]

She doesn't generally mince her words and has a real low tolerance for fools.
It wouldn't be practical for the RSPCA to be involved in beekeeping for many reasons. But bees are the only animal people can keep and there are no consequences for neglect or ignorance other than financial loss. Is this right? well to people that care about bees no but to the general population they're just a buzzy pest that they like in a field and not nearby.
I get her point, but the RSPCA involved in bees is a bit ridiculous.
Normally a couple of years of total loss they suddenly become allergic and take up another hobby so it sorts itself in the end.

The BBKA cannot force people to do training and has no standard for training or tutors that its member associations have to abide by.
Any mug can start teaching beekeeping, I've seen people with 12 months of experience doing it who haven't a clue but deliver tripe with confidence. My wife drags me away from association stands at shows as the drivel spouted to the public by these experienced beekeepers generally gets a response they don't like.

Beekeeping is like a lot of other things in life, to the average person any rubbish delivered with confidence is accepted as the truth.

I find myself agreeing with all you say save for perhaps, I think Celia's classification bees are animals is a little suspect. This classification would give the RSPCA an automatic pass to get involved / intervene.

Re the BBKA, certainly my understanding of the training syllabus associations give is designed to pass BBKA qualifications so there's a link somewhere I think.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

my understanding of the training syllabus associations give is designed to pass BBKA qualifications

yep - and nothing to do with good bee husbandry

 

[Erichalfbee]

My wife drags me away from association stands at shows as the drivel spouted to the public by these experienced beekeepers generally gets a response they don't like.

Ah… I know the feeling

 

[madasafish]

If the RSPCA got involved in children, a number of Social Services Departments would be closed and the heads prosecuted.(think Rotherham and other areas)
If they got involved in hospitals, ditto.

 

[MJNT]

they’d have to get a load of new staff to provide with enormous pensions and some with free housing and maybe enjoy a little more prosecuting of some sad individuals rather than just the real baddies rather than prevention funded by legacies . Invertebrates don’t qualify for protection at present… except now for the current investigation and possibly inclusion of sentient higher invertebrates. The default position is unless we can prove sentience assume aversion behaviour is nothing to do with pain rather than turning that on its head. Not long ago puppies couldn’t really feel pain so you could chop off bits of tail and dew claws without anaesthetic

 

[Gilberdyke John]

they’d have to get a load of new staff to provide with enormous pensions and some with free housing and maybe enjoy a little more prosecuting of some sad individuals rather than just the real baddies rather than prevention funded by legacies . Invertebrates don’t qualify for protection at present… except now for the current investigation and possibly inclusion of sentient higher invertebrates. The default position is unless we can prove sentience assume aversion behaviour is nothing to do with pain rather than turning that on its head. Not long ago puppies couldn’t really feel pain so you could chop off bits of tail and dew claws without anaesthetic

I once made the mistake of telephoning the rspca about a horse with neglected overgrown feet. Nothing was done about it but I got begging phone calls wanting me to sign up for subscriptions for ages. World Horse Welfare were much more effective and chased up the owner.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

I once made the mistake of telephoning the rspca about a horse with neglected overgrown feet. Nothing was done about it but I got begging phone calls wanting me to sign up for subscriptions for ages. World Horse Welfare were much more effective and chased up the owner.

yep, a few years ago I'd gone for a drive to scope out some land for shooting and my father's cousin flagged me down - he was out for a walk and had found a horse which had slipped and got stuck on it's back in a ditch. neither of us knew who owned it so I called the RSPCA for help - they just weren't interested and said as much to me. In the end I had to sort the whole thing out meself.