Requeening an Agressive Hive

[Fahey]

Any advice on the the best way to requeen an agressive hive?

 

[Arfermo]

Surely the answer is obvious. Either buy in new q after squishing the old 'un or squish her and leave them quenless to make their own emergency q. Can't think of a better way!!!!

 

[barratt_sab]

When we had a problem colony and needed to do anything that was going to take any time, we would wait until a day when the bees were flying, then put a stand and floor a few yards away from the problem hive and move the problem brood box onto the new stand and floor. We would then put a spare bb and some frames on the old floor, put crown boards on both and leave them for an hour.

By the time we went back to the problem bb a lot of the foragers were in the box on the old stand, leaving fewer bees on the brood. When we were done, we would put the hive back together on the original stand and shake the bees out of the spare brood box.

We used to do the initial move, then work through the other hives on that site, do the problem colony last, put it all back together again and leave!

 

[tomtit]

They some time kill the new queen.kill the old queen remove any queen cells. when they have no eggs to turn into queens give them some eggs from another hive.But make sure they are healthy have a queen and not over run with mites as this will also make them bad tempered

 

[victor meldrew]

Surely the answer is obvious. Either buy in new q after squishing the old 'un or squish her and leave them quenless to make their own emergency q. Can't think of a better way!!!!

The question wasn't one to be dismissed with a one liner!,,
Finding the old Queen in an aggressive colony is daunting in itself!.
As I imagine the op will view your post !
To find the old Queen, move the hive at least 10 yards and put a brood box in it's place !
Give it 30/40 minutes , by this time all the flying bees should have left the hive and returned to the brood box on the original site.
You can now examine the hive without having bees pinging off your veil
If the queen is illusive take another box place it near the hive and put half the frames in it , place them in pairs with a gap between the pairs , do like wise with the remaining frames in the hive .as the Queen will shy away from day light, you should find her hiding between a pair of frames in one of the boxes .
Squish her ,reassemble hive . Move the catch box, place the hive back on it's floor .
You now have everything back to normal save the Queen.
Go through the hive in about a week and tear down any emergency Queen cells . By this time the bees will have nothing to make a Queen from, meaning you can introduce a bought in Queen with out them superseding her with a Queen from the original aggressive one ?
VM


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[Hebeegeebee]

Fahey,

Assuming you can find the queen, do an artificial swarm so the queen is on one frame on the old site. In the other brood box the older flyers will leave resulting in a queenless colony a few feet away which is better at accepting a queen than a full colony. (Requeen later in the day after the A/S). Keep the queen in her cage for 2 or 3 days before breaking off the plastic tab (check for queencells and destroy them if you find any) and then let the bees eat out the candy to release her. Once she has been laying for a couple of weeks, you can then unite with the bad-tempered colony using newspaper, squashing the bad queen.

Just squashing the queen at this time of year is not reliable and could result in a nasty queenless colony. Queen acceptance is better in spring and autumn.

 

[Hebeegeebee]

The question wasn't one to be dismissed with a one liner!,,

Agreed

 

[herefordshirehoney]

Am I right in thinking even know you have an aggressive queen that you are better trying to put her in a queen cage with some workers and fondant just incase requeening doesnt work? And spraying water every few days keeping in a warm dark place? Or does that sound a silly idea..... I do like having a backup plan incase the main plan of action fails. I'm not sure how long a queen would last in this fashion though......

That been said as long as you have another hive you should have another backup plan of introducing a frame of eggs as its an aggressive queen so keeping wouldnt be the best idea.

 

[Fahey]

Victor,
I like the sound of what you are suggesting, I know some say that agressive bees can be good foragers, but the're at the house and I'm just not enjoying it as they are buzzing me as soon as I approach the hive. They don't seem to bother my wife though. My other hives are all very calm.

 

[oliver90owner]

squish her and leave them quenless to make their own emergency q.

That is about the worst way to do it. Six weeks, maybe more, to wait for new bees, possibly a scrub queen and still the same genes. A recipe for a continuing disaster.

 

[Luminos]

The question wasn't one to be dismissed with a one liner!,,
Finding the old Queen in an aggressive colony is daunting in itself!.
As I imagine the op will view your post !
To find the old Queen, move the hive at least 10 yards and put a brood box in it's place !
Give it 30/40 minutes , by this time all the flying bees should have left the hive and returned to the brood box on the original site.
You can now examine the hive without having bees pinging off your veil
If the queen is illusive take another box place it near the hive and put half the frames in it , place them in pairs with a gap between the pairs , do like wise with the remaining frames in the hive .as the Queen will shy away from day light, you should find her hiding between a pair of frames in one of the boxes .
Squish her ,reassemble hive . Move the catch box, place the hive back on it's floor .
You now have everything back to normal save the Queen.
Go through the hive in about a week and tear down any emergency Queen cells . By this time the bees will have nothing to make a Queen from, meaning you can introduce a bought in Queen with out them superseding her with a Queen from the original aggressive one ?
VM


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Fahey has more than one colony, so...if having done all the above, he introduced a frame with eggs from a gentle colony, would they raise a queen from it? Would that work?

 

[victor meldrew]

Yes they would
The reason I suggested a bought in Queen, was that the aggressive colony will have drones carrying the aggressive Queens genes , increasing the chances of the replacement Queen also being aggressive !
I am not aware of any anti incest strategies amongst honeybees save swarming !
Maybe someone will provide an answer ?
VM


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[Luminos]

Thanks VM
I knew there was something I hadn't thought of...drones...

 

[Bosveldleeu]

Requeening

To requeen you need to find the queen and destroy her first.

I have had to requeen a very defensive colony, and found the following PDF very helpful in helping find or isolating the queen:

I am not allowed to post links or images yet - so:

Just Google "7 ways to find the queen" and follow the link to bobsbeekeeping.

Let me know how you got on.

Hope it helps and good luck.

 

[BeeJayBee]

Just Google "7 ways to find the queen" and follow the link to

...... this thread

http://www.beekeepingforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=16875

 

[Fahey]

Thank's for taking the time to comment chaps.....lots of food for thought. I have a good Carni queen in Manchester, very gentle bees, might take a few eggs or, as I've just done a Demaree, see if any nice QC's are produced next weekend.
Other possibility is buying a mated queen from the same source as her, saving time.

 

[victor meldrew]

The adage that carnie x local mongrels are bad news isn't without foundation !
Vm


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[Cazza]

For real belt and braces if you are introducing new genetics, you could do what I am in the process of doing which is to make up a nuc and add your new queen to this first until well established. Then cull old queen and newspaper method the nuc. Long winded but a better guarantee of acceptance if the colony is really ******.
Cazza

 

[Swarm]

For real belt and braces if you are introducing new genetics, you could do what I am in the process of doing which is to make up a nuc and add your new queen to this first until well established. Then cull old queen and newspaper method the nuc. Long winded but a better guarantee of acceptance if the colony is really ******.
Cazza

 

[Skyhook]

Now is not the best time to do it. Less likely to get the queen killed in spring or autumn. She is also less likely to be killed using the nuc method.

I had one hive I simply couldn't inspect they were so malicious. I mixed up a small hand spray of water and fairy liquid. Kicked the hive, a couple of hundred bees came out to investigate, and got sprayed. Dead in seconds. Repeat until attack squad is reduced to taste. I was then able to go in, find and kill the queen, and let them raise a replacement. Thay have become my gentlest hive.

I could have moved the hive away to reduce the flyers, but frankly I didn't want them back. Not to everyones taste I know (I'm sure it won't be to Heidi's), but it did it for me.

.