Plastic Foundation

[enrico]

Do they go in if you bend them and slot them in rather than sliding them down. The top removable bar makes no difference if it sticks out. I have some wide ones in my stock that stick out even with wax. The bees don't mind if things don't line up!
E

 

[Hachi]

E

No. I've laid a plastic sheet over a wax sheet and the wax sheet is about 5mm wider and 2-3mm taller.

Its [plastic] too deep to fit/rest between the bottom bars too

 

[eltalia]

Plastic foundation regardless of wax afterthoughts was junk in the 70's
to only evolve through that market incapable of wiring frames, and so
it hangs on still today.
Bees resist using the product.
Recyclers wont touch the product.
Destruction is a right PITA.

But hey, every piece made is sold, just like Friday's automobile.

Bill

 

[Wingy]

I bought 30 national sheets of the black plastic foundation from Bee Eqpt and just tried to fit them into a brood frame and on first pass they don't fit.


The sheet wont locate in (too thick) and slide down the grooves on the side bars and the strip of wood you remove from the top bar that pins wax foundation in sits proud ie it protrudes further out than it does when you put fresh wax in if you see what I mean.

Do I need different frames?

If so which ones?

I cant call Bee Eqpt as they're closed on the weekends.

What have you guys / Girls done?

Thanks

I’m sure on their website they have frames listed for “wax” and for “plastic” foundation. I bought a full Langstroth hive with plastic foundation and the frames are different from the other frames I have.
They went together with no issues

 

[Hachi]

I’m sure on their website they have frames listed for “wax” and for “plastic” foundation. I bought a full Langstroth hive with plastic foundation and the frames are different from the other frames I have.
They went together with no issues

Just looked again and I can't find any listed. They have pre-assembled stuff and the sheets but not just the frames.

I was wondering if anyone here had any experience of fitting them? I bought just the sheets as they are advertised as BS Nat I assumed they'd fit. If I used std frames they would only be secured at the top bar that would make inspections very difficult I'd have thought when fully laden. They'd present problems similar to a top bar hive I'd guess.

 

[Beefriendly]

Plastic foundation regardless of wax afterthoughts was junk in the 70's
to only evolve through that market incapable of wiring frames, and so
it hangs on still today./QUOTE]

I think it's a product that many beekeepers play around with before going back to wax foundation, wired or unwired.

 

[colinc]

As I said in post one I have no experience other than plastic. For the reasons mentioned above regarding disposal it is no use to commercial guys and as I said in my first post I intend to gradually switch to foundation. Mann lake royally dumped on bee equipment and then left the uk market. My national hybrids from them are an abomination. The gradual change I am doing to standard nationals is a P.I.T.A.

But unlike the few posts on here to the contrary, my bees do not dislike using it. They draw it well, and harvests are easy, inspections no worry and I just fancy a change like Hachi.

It seems a massive number of YouTubing backyard keepers in the states use one piece plastic frame and foundation. I am sorry that Hachi is struggling with his frames, I just needed to answer his question to me regarding Plastic.


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[Helen]

I use ritecell plastic foundation - yellow for supers, black for brood. No problem drawing brood foundation - even if interleaved with wax foundation. They are a little more resistant at drawing super foundation but do it eventually.

I find it doesn't go into the side-bar frame slots, but simply attaches top and bottom. As it's rigid, it's fine. The foundation has a thin lip along the top and bottom edge which does fit in the top/bottom bars. But you need to nail it a bit more forceably as it's quite tough.

If you want to make the lip larger, simply run a sharp blade along it to cut under the extruded cell and it'll come off easily.

 

[Stiffy]

Checked some hives earlier, one still had a frame of plastic ritecell still in. The frames were all put in at the same time, I think the photo shows how much the bees like it
S

 

[colinc]

Checked some hives earlier, one still had a frame of plastic ritecell still in. The frames were all put in at the same time, I think the photo shows how much the bees like it
S

How much “your” bees like it....

...when given a choice.

Just as has been said.

I have 4 hives full of it top to bottom and no such issue. Ritecell I believe state not to give them the choice of plastic vs wax. If no choice they draw fine.

But..... I am going to be moving to wax.


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[denise washington]

Hachi what i did with mine i got a craft knife and cut into comb on both sides and bottom just took a fine strip off just enough to fit into frame bit messy but they fit ok

 

[Hachi]

Ok thanks i'll go look again

 

[Michael Palmer]

I bought 800 Pierco a while back. The bees draw them no problem on a flow. If they don't draw it the way you want, you just scrape back to the midrib and they have another go.
I'm just using them in nucs now as I went back to wood/wax

The black Pierco is great for spotting eggs/small larvae in the base.

I've always been a wax foundation advocate. Wired foundation and wired frames.Works wall for me...under the proper conditions. Install it in hives under less than proper conditions and they chew it to pieces. I've used some Pierco plastic deep foundation in the past. Works well if condition of flow and colony are are ideal. I've used it in medium extracting frames for years, just not brood comb.

This year, I tried Acorn plastic foundation. Owner of company set up Pierco years ago, and left the company to set up his own. Acorn has better, more defined cell bases than Pierco.

Set up a dipping tank from an old Maxant bottling tank, with a 5000w heater. 10"m0f wax floating on half tank of water. Running at 190˚F. Getting 10 lb. wax on 100 sheets. The bees are all over it. Beautiful comb.

 

[colinc]

Thanks for that. First positive endorsement from a commercial level Beekeeper.

Do you know if they have done anything different to ease disposal or recycling?


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[Hachi]

I use ritecell plastic foundation - yellow for supers, black for brood. No problem drawing brood foundation - even if interleaved with wax foundation. They are a little more resistant at drawing super foundation but do it eventually.

I find it doesn't go into the side-bar frame slots, but simply attaches top and bottom. As it's rigid, it's fine. The foundation has a thin lip along the top and bottom edge which does fit in the top/bottom bars. But you need to nail it a bit more forceably as it's quite tough.

If you want to make the lip larger, simply run a sharp blade along it to cut under the extruded cell and it'll come off easily.

Back in the man cave this am and played with the sheets and whilst its a bit time consuming and the first two were a bit fiddly I think I've worked it out. Thanks Helen. I've bought 30 sheets so will use these and compare and see how we go.

 

[B+.]

I've always been a wax foundation advocate. Wired foundation and wired frames.Works wall for me...under the proper conditions. Install it in hives under less than proper conditions and they chew it to pieces. I've used some Pierco plastic deep foundation in the past. Works well if condition of flow and colony are are ideal. I've used it in medium extracting frames for years, just not brood comb.

This year, I tried Acorn plastic foundation. Owner of company set up Pierco years ago, and left the company to set up his own. Acorn has better, more defined cell bases than Pierco.

Set up a dipping tank from an old Maxant bottling tank, with a 5000w heater. 10"m0f wax floating on half tank of water. Running at 190˚F. Getting 10 lb. wax on 100 sheets. The bees are all over it. Beautiful comb.

I've never used Acorn Mike. I bought the Pierco (unwaxed) quite a few years ago but have returned to using wood frames and beeswax foundation over the last few years.
I still have the black Pierco full depth frames which I'm really just keeping for the nucs/queen rearing. My bees accept them quite well when there is a flow on. After midsummer they tend to be a bit inconsistent, but, that's just down to the nectar flow around here. I scrape anything off that I don't like.

 

[Helen]

whilst its a bit time consuming and the first two were a bit fiddly I think I've worked it out.

Here's a couple of photos of mine drawing out ritecell brood. It's 14x12, having fiddled a bit around with it as well.

 

[Beefriendly]

Can someone please remind us of the advantages of plastic foundation?
Has anyone had to cut it back to the original rib for the bees to reuse it?
If it also need coating in beeswax before use...help me here I'm struggling