Lecture "The Sustainable Apiary" 29th Oct Bromsgrove

[Chris B]

Following on from his lecture series at The National Honey Show, Mike Palmer from Vermont, USA will be at Bromsgrove School at 7.30 p.m. on Tuesday 29th October. Full details here:

http://wbka.net/?p=event&event_id=176

We have a nice big lecture hall so can accommodate a few guests as long as you let me know if you intend to come (so I can book the right amount of catering).

Entry by voluntary donation of whatever you can afford (we'll be breaking even at around £5 per head).

 

[beebreeder]

Would love to come Chris but I do not think I would get there in time after the day job!!!

 

[sipa]

After hearing him at the honey show everybody should make the effort to hear his lectures.

Clear, informative and inspiring.

 

[Erichalfbee]

Chris B
Any chance of a video on Youtube for us too far away to go ?

 

[alanf]

Chris B
Any chance of a video on Youtube for us too far away to go ?

A high chance, maybe not youtube. Mike Palmer's talks were some of the ones captured at the NHS. Fairly high standard equipment, two cameras, radio mike. The introduction included that the recording would be made available "at some point" at no cost via the NHS web site.

The recording must be part of the "deal" in the booking. Celia Davis, for instance, was not recorded; Mike Palmer and Robert Paxton were (and will be worth watching). I have seen short talks by Mike Palmer on Youtube so he's obviously OK with the idea but you wouldn't want to record without his permission and without establishing the quality of the finished product.

 

[Chris B]

Chris B
Any chance of a video on Youtube for us too far away to go ?

Sounds like I won't need to bother as it's the same lecture as the NHS.

 

[clv101]

An audio recording (and any slides he used) would be appreciated by many.

 

[Hachi]

Not enough advanced notice I'm afraid. Shame I would have made the effort.

 

[REDWOOD]

Chris B
Any chance of a video on Youtube for us too far away to go ?

http://vimeo.com/23178333

 

[user 6228]

Just watched the Video.

Seeing those hives in the snow is enough to make me cry ... 60% losses

Why oh why do they think a bee should survive with 1/2" of wood on the ground in deep snow in a climate that is towards the Northern limit of their natural range.

I'm just appalled at the waste in modern North American bee keeping...the colonies dying and the replacement packages etc...

The guy talking has a valid solution given the kit the North Americans use and the fact that he really does care means the descriptions of the terrible losses in North America hit home.

This guy has a solution to a problem that shouldnt even exist in the first place.


Derek
Head in hands

 

[sipa]

Derekm, could you lay out the perfect spec for a polyhive as you see it, I'd be very interested in your recommendations.

 

[user 6228]

Derekm, could you lay out the perfect spec for a polyhive as you see it, I'd be very interested in your recommendations.

A similar thermal conductance to a tree cavity with 6" walls would be a start.

 

[sipa]

Can you recommend the thickness of poly at 100gm cm3

 

[Jimmy]

An excellent talk by Mike Palmer, well worth going to see him if you get a chance. He spoke of incredulity at the prices charged for UK nucs and queens and disparagingly of imported queens. His nuc approach is widely documented on the internet as is a video of very similar looking talks he has given.
Not many speakers can hold an audience's attention for 100+ minutes; he did so with ease.
Mike spoke warmly of Hivemaker who I think he had been to see and who now appears to be formerly of this parish?

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

I think HM is still here - just doesn't post (may be wrong?)

 

[taff..]

I was at the talk he gave on monday night, no doubt the same talk as he's given many times whilst he's been in the UK. I was incredibly interesting and fascinating to see how beekeeping can be done on a huge scale.

I'm not sure how his theories can easily be translated to be of use to a 2 colony beekeeper, but it's an idea that can be kept in the back pocket for future use

Just watched the Video.

Seeing those hives in the snow is enough to make me cry ... 60% losses

Why oh why do they think a bee should survive with 1/2" of wood on the ground in deep snow in a climate that is towards the Northern limit of their natural range.

have you ever heard anyone saying that cold does not kill bees, damp kills bees, he said this a couple of times.

 

[Michael Palmer]

Hello Derek, I read your post, so I thought I might reply. You should know a bit more about keeping bees where I do. I think perhaps all you've heard is what you see in the media. Don'e believe all you've heard.

First, snow is good. It insulates the hives from the bitter cold. And the losses at 60%? Not with me. I average about 15% loss in winter. I use 3/4" wood. For winter the crown boards are insulated with polystyrene board, and a wrap of lightweight roofing felt is applied. The bees winter here rather easily, if I've done my job right. That is raising queens from good stock and preparing properly for winter. Cold just doesn't kill bees.

Now, I'm appalled too about the things going on in the US bee industry. Beekeeping in the US is tied at the hip to package bees. If you lose your bees, there's pretty much only one game in town. Package bees. So, hundreds of thousands of packages raised under less than ideal conditions....the queens are rubbish. Full of nosema, drone layers, virgins running free in the package.

Those of us that raise our stocks with a an eye to quality..quality always trumps quantity...are doing okay. The biggest issue now is loss of forage. Agriculture in my area is about maize. No more pastures, no more hedgerows, no more clover.

So don't get the wrong idea. Some segments of US beekeeping are certainly in trouble, but not everyone.
Mike

Just watched the Video.

Seeing those hives in the snow is enough to make me cry ... 60% losses

Why oh why do they think a bee should survive with 1/2" of wood on the ground in deep snow in a climate that is towards the Northern limit of their natural range.

I'm just appalled at the waste in modern North American bee keeping...the colonies dying and the replacement packages etc...

The guy talking has a valid solution given the kit the North Americans use and the fact that he really does care means the descriptions of the terrible losses in North America hit home.

This guy has a solution to a problem that shouldnt even exist in the first place.


Derek
Head in hands

 

[user 6228]

Hello Derek, I read your post, so I thought I might reply. You should know a bit more about keeping bees where I do. I think perhaps all you've heard is what you see in the media. Don'e believe all you've heard.

First, snow is good. It insulates the hives from the bitter cold. And the losses at 60%? Not with me. I average about 15% loss in winter. I use 3/4" wood. For winter the crown boards are insulated with polystyrene board, and a wrap of lightweight roofing felt is applied. The bees winter here rather easily, if I've done my job right. That is raising queens from good stock and preparing properly for winter. Cold just doesn't kill bees.

Now, I'm appalled too about the things going on in the US bee industry. Beekeeping in the US is tied at the hip to package bees. If you lose your bees, there's pretty much only one game in town. Package bees. So, hundreds of thousands of packages raised under less than ideal conditions....the queens are rubbish. Full of nosema, drone layers, virgins running free in the package.

Those of us that raise our stocks with a an eye to quality..quality always trumps quantity...are doing okay. The biggest issue now is loss of forage. Agriculture in my area is about maize. No more pastures, no more hedgerows, no more clover.

So don't get the wrong idea. Some segments of US beekeeping are certainly in trouble, but not everyone.
Mike

mike,
Thanks for replying, I am more an engineer and experimental physicist, and when i hear the modern u.s. folks having top vents in winter I wonder where they get their ideas on heat and mass transfer from.

I use modern materials and make thermal measurements of the hives i use , but the principles are close to those of oldtime US beekeepers such as Everett Franklin Phillips

This picture shows the level of insulation (for summer) thats needed to give bees an environment close to an average tree nest

 

[TryingToLetThemBee]

I read today that the going rate for a hive on the California almonds is $150-200 and soaring. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/...-prices-rocket-due-to-honey-bee-shortage.html

 

[Michael Palmer]

mike,
Thanks for replying, I am more an engineer and experimental physicist, and when i hear the modern u.s. folks having top vents in winter I wonder where they get their ideas on heat and mass transfer from.

I'm just a beekeeper with 40years experience with keeping bees in an area where we have temperatures of -20F to -25F every winter. Our bees must endure extended periods of cold which eliminate cleansing flights from December to April. This past spring, the bees first flight was April 1 and the first pollen came in on April 15. Think of it...your bees can gather pollen on Boxing day, after a late Autumn of Ivy pollen and nectar.

But bees reared from good stocks winter very well even under such conditions. One issue we have is moisture. Because of the very cold temperatures, moisture can condense inside the hive. To prevent this, we need to do two things you probably don't. Our hives require insulation on the crown board, and an upper entrance to allow the excess moisture to escape the hive as vapor. The opening doesn't have to be large...3/8"x1" is plenty. Combined with that entrance is a wide open bottom entrance protected by 1/2" wire mesh to keep mice out of the hive.

Now, for most of the winter, our hives are half buried in snow, and the bees can't fly from the bottom entrances. If weather for a cleansing flight were to present itself, the bees wouldn't be able to fly...so an upper entrance is critical.

I hope you can see the difference in our climate and how it effects our beekeeping practices.