Leaving on Supers

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Joined
Oct 17, 2011
Messages
238
Reaction score
16
Location
Ireland
Hive Type
National
Number of Hives
22
We have had an absolutely miserable season – [Swarming/Queenless colonies/ DLQ’s and Laying Workers]. We are now advised to feed (not without cause). We are considering leaving the supers of honey with the bees. The Brood Boxes are neigh-on bone dry (They moved stores to the supers). Is it proper that the full super is placed under the Brood Box so that they might move the stores up? Does it need be scored to start the process?
 
I would put it under. I would put in an entrance block to reduce the risk of robbing. I would not score the honey because if there is a dearth, it sometimes triggers robbing, especially if it drips through the OMF.
 
One view, which I subscribe to, is that if the bees have moved the stores to where they want and expect them to be, why then rearrange it differently?

Whether you nadir the super or not, you must remove the queen excluder when leaving the hive for winter.
 
No point at all in putting a shallow of stores below the brood nest, IMO.

If you are expecting them to move it up - why put it there in the first place?
Bees put their winter stores where they can a) protect it - they are between those stores and any potential robbers while not clustered, b) bees leaving the cluster to feed during the winter go upwards, not downwards where they could get cooled and succumb, c) stores above the bees will not approach freezing temperatures while the cluster is giving out warmth and d) the bees will be using up unnecessary stores while moving it - both actually physically moving it and that while moving it unnecessarily they are not doing other, more useful, work.

The only plus, for some beekeepers, is convenience for them, at the expense of the bees. They usually argue that the queen will not lay in the shallow in spring - what a lame reason that is!

I occasionally place some (usually incompletely filled) frames below the brood box if the bees need a little more stores. Always done before they cluster, hopefully!

I would not normally leave the crop, just everything collected after removal of same. My bees normally stock up, afterwards, with late crops and particularly ivy. With support from the beekeeper ensuring weaker colonies are united almost always means some spare frames of stores - either to distribute late in the year or stored for use later if capped.

So, in a nutshell, waste of time and effort for the bees, convenience for the beekeeper.
 
:iagree:
Leave the super on....a lot of folk are on brood and a half these days. If that doesn't suit then rearrange things in the spring. Take the excluder off.
As per RAB I do put uncapped frames under the brood box after I have taken any crop and the honey is moved into the brood box .....but then I have 14x12s and the brood box is big enough to get them through winter without a super
 
We have had an absolutely miserable season – [Swarming/Queenless colonies/ DLQ’s and Laying Workers]. We are now advised to feed (not without cause). We are considering leaving the supers of honey with the bees. The Brood Boxes are neigh-on bone dry (They moved stores to the supers). Is it proper that the full super is placed under the Brood Box so that they might move the stores up? Does it need be scored to start the process?

when you say brood boxes, are you on double brood boxes, and is there brood in one brood box or both if double brood,
 
A widely held misconception seems to be the belief that bees should only have brood in deeps and honey in shallows. Bees don't care how big each box is or how big the frames are, or even if they're above or below a QX, what they do care about is how they arrange the topology of their brood and stores.

If the size of the box that the bees do things in is inconvenient, then investigate the Rose hive, you'll find it has many advantages.
http://www.-----------------/what-are-rose-hives.html
Even if you don't adopt the Rose method, understanding it will make you think about what the bees actually need and what conventional beekeeper conveniences are counter-productive for them.

A good question to ask oneself about EVERY aspect of our craft is
"Is this for the benefit of the bee, or the beekeeper?"
 
Do you get much of an Ivy flow in your location? If so, why not extract the honey in the supers and give them some syrup to last them til the ivy flow? Even if there is no flow there is nothing wrong with feeding syrup for the winter if you wish to keep the honey.
 
Are they not getting anything from the Bramble ? In flower near you ?

Weather that is really limiting things, but any sort of improvement, if soon, should see some stores coming in.
 
I am of the view that extra space is actually a disadvantage to the bees in Winter. It means more air for them to humidify and warm. A certain Finnish man calls this 'vain space'.
 
I am a bit concerned that on the 1st day of August you believe the bees have finished! I know you probably know what flora you have locally but...... I would only be panicking if it was the middle of September!
E
 
I am a bit concerned that on the 1st day of August you believe the bees have finished! I know you probably know what flora you have locally but...... I would only be panicking if it was the middle of September!
E

That's what husband says.
I have just extracted one and a half supers (all that was capped on four hives) and I'm fussing that that's all we'll get.
This honey is dark and has been capped for some time so I'm guessing it's from spring time.
Ooooooodles of Balsam quarter of a mile away but they don't seem to have found it.
How are your Limes, enrico?
 

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