Leave alone or intervene?

[bjosephd]

8 days ago
AS Q- parent colony in new position

3 days ago inspected
Queen cells drawn. Some capped.
Left 2 well developed, well charged, open cells that were formed touching each other.
Tore down all other queen cells & cups etc (I hope!).

After a while with very quiet hive entrance, bees beginning to be promoted to forager status and flying.

Can't be sure when those cells will have been capped.

Should I inspect and choose a cell?
Is it too late? Too early?
How impossibly delicate are they in their cells? And so are those frames totally untouchable?
Should I check for any further missed queen cells just in case?
Do I assume the bees have read the books and that they probably aren't strong enough to throw a cast since they've only just started flying again?
Do I just leave them, hope one queen kills the other, and look forward to a mated queen by the end of the month without having lost a cast?
Ideally I'm after damage limitation so imagine (as often) the best next step/advice is "leave them alone!" and inspect on the 30th?
Another idea that I've missed?
How might I have done this differently/better? What might I consider next time?


Thanks!

BJD

-edit- p.s. potential inspection days are looking like tomowrrow (weds 8th) or Saturday 11th.

 

[Erichalfbee]

Checking for QCs five days after AS should be OK.
Leaving 2 is asking for a cast if the colony is strong but it's difficult to reduce to one if the cells are made together. You might damage the one you leave.
How far from the AS colony have you put the parent?
If to one side then I would simply swap it to the other side to bleed bees off into the AS. That way you weaken the colony making it less likely to afterswarm.
You are bleeding off foragers so make sure they have stores.

I would have left one open cell
better still I would have split them differently. Pagden has a high failure rate in my opinion ......but others will disagree I'm sure

 

[bjosephd]

Thanks Erica.
They are about 100 ish meters away over the road in the orchard now, so moving not an option I'm afraid.
Yes, I ummed and arred about leaving more than 1 QC... I couldn't decide between the two and wonderd about damage... these two very close ones however were clearly the QCs that had recieved the most attention and were biggest etc and as not capped then reasonably 'youngest' and unrushed.
The colony had pretty good stores, and I fed with pollen patty just to ensure they had good protein for feeding queen lavae... I have some thymolated syrup that I could use and put on tonight if you think feeding is a good idea? Or is that again a potential stimulant to swarming/a cast?
Tomorrow or Saturday are probably my available days/decent weather days that I can make any further action.

BJD

 

[bjosephd]

What's your prefered method rather than Pagden Erica?

Should I go in and remove one cell ya think? Or will the queens be incredibly fragile now in their cells?

 

[Erichalfbee]

Wally Shaws modified Snelgrove works better for me.
If you think you can get at one of those cells without damaging the other then reduce to one.

 

[bjosephd]

I read often about the fragility of developement soon after capping when the developing queens are in a very sensitive phase and shouldn't be handled... is this sensitivity exagerated?

Obviously I wouldn't be shaking any bees off the frames! But would be nervous that a little accidental knock screws things up completely!

I handle my frames pretty much like a bomb at the best of times to be honest... haha

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

two cells close together should be OK - bees will find it hard to protect the one from the first queen out. I would leave well alone now for at least four weeks

 

[MerryBee]

Checking for QCs five days after AS should be OK.

I disagree. I would leave it at least 7 days. It is perfectly possible for bees to raise emergency cells on 5-7 day old larvae ( that is 5-7 days after egg laid).

Queens raised on these however likely to be inferior due to inadequate nutrition.

 

[Erichalfbee]

I usually look in day 6

two cells close together should be OK - bees will find it hard to protect the one from the first queen out. I would leave well alone now for at least four weeks

You're probably right. If you interfere with one it might well be the wrong one

 

[bjosephd]

Haha... how about 5.75 days? Or 6.3?
Teehee

Aaanyway. I'm kinda feeling general consensus is leave QCs alone.

Worth doing a final sweep on other frames? They were checked on 5th day after AS.

(a guy at the pub last night said what I should do is catch them between emergence and cut out the remaining cell and rehome that queen cell in a nuc! Riiiight because getting that timing would be eaaasy! Maybe I'll sit there 24/7 with an endoscope!)