Laying workers?

[jenkinsbrynmair]

.
I have 2 hopelessly Queenless hives with Queen’s arriving on Friday, thinking i will wait until I’ve got them introduced before shaking LW hive out?

would be better to wait a week

 

[Parsonage Bees]

I had a failed nuc where the comb was all drone.
Set up with QC in mid-May. QC emerged but by mid June there were multiple eggs in cells. End of June looked like this:-



I intended to shake them out but 20th June I pruned out some QCs from another colony and found 2 VQs emerging. Instead of squishing them I marked them (badly) and let them walk into the nuc. Yesterday saw one of the queens again mated and laying well. Brood looks spotty because she's laid around the drones some of which died as they emerged, little bigger than workers.
Maybe just lucky but impressed by this queen having survived, got mated and brought round a colony after a numpty beekeeper painted her left eye.

 

[Erichalfbee]

I read somewhere, I think it was The Apiarist that the LW are often unable to fly back to the hive due to the egg burden they are carrying.

It’s wrong.

 

[BeeBird]

I had a failed nuc where the comb was all drone.
Set up with QC in mid-May. QC emerged but by mid June there were multiple eggs in cells. End of June looked like this:-

View attachment 40854

I intended to shake them out but 20th June I pruned out some QCs from another colony and found 2 VQs emerging. Instead of squishing them I marked them (badly) and let them walk into the nuc. Yesterday saw one of the queens again mated and laying well. Brood looks spotty because she's laid around the drones some of which died as they emerged, little bigger than workers.
Maybe just lucky but impressed by this queen having survived, got mated and brought round a colony after a numpty beekeeper painted her left eye.

View attachment 40855

Wow that’s amazing, nature with a little help from the beekeeper wins through

 

[BeeBird]

would be better to wait a week

Thanks I will do

 

[BeeBird]

It’s wrong.

I wonder how these falsities get published? Obviously not a peer reviewed publication.
Not too disappointed as I wasn’t looking forward to moving them 50 yards to shake them out

 

[Sutty]

I've wondered, given a laying worker colony with lots of foraging bees, whether placing a Q+ colony on top separated by mesh and with an entrance for the top colony would suppress the LWs after a couple of weeks and allow them to accept a new queen or even raise one from a test frame when separated again.

 

[BeeBird]

I've wondered, given a laying worker colony with lots of foraging bees, whether placing a Q+ colony on top separated by mesh and with an entrance for the top colony would suppress the LWs after a couple of weeks and allow them to accept a new queen or even raise one from a test frame when separated again.

Interesting idea it might be worth a try. I do have a couple of Q+ nuc’s so can’t think there would be anything to lose in putting one of them over the LW colony.
Has anyone tried this?

 

[ericbeaumont]

tried this?

Nor exactly that, but one year I took the LW hive away, put in its place a Q+ nuc, shook out the LWs somewhere, and a couple of days later upgraded the nuc to a hive. Result: happy ever after.

 

[BeeBird]

Nor exactly that, but one year I took the LW hive away, put in its place a Q+ nuc, shook out the LWs somewhere, and a couple of days later upgraded the nuc to a hive. Result: happy ever after.

That sounds interesting, I’m tempted to give it a go. Can’t see that there will be much to lose. Going to get my 2 new Queens introduced then give it a go

 

[Amaranth]

Is it possible that beyond a certain distance, dumped laying workers can’t find their way back to their own hive because they have been reared from the start as laying workers, so have never done foraging duties therefore don’t know the landmarks beyond the immediate surrounding of the hive?

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Is it possible that beyond a certain distance, dumped laying workers can’t find their way back to their own hive because they have been reared from the start as laying workers, so have never done foraging duties

no - because that is not what happens - foragers, nurses et al are capable of, and do lay eggs, they are not 'reared' just for laying

 

[ericbeaumont]

reared from the start as laying workers, so have never done foraging duties therefore don’t know the landmarks

Those may do, but as JBM said, allsorts turn LW, so foragers would return and prevent the requeening of the colony.

 

[BeeBird]

Is it possible that beyond a certain distance, dumped laying workers can’t find their way back to their own hive because they have been reared from the start as laying workers, so have never done foraging duties therefore don’t know the landmarks beyond the immediate surrounding of the hive?

That’s what I have read. Which suggested that the LW are predominantly house bee’s that if shaken out a distance from the hive will be unable to return as they haven’t been outside and have not oriented. So they will basically be lost in what will be a wilderness to them.
It makes sense that if they have never left the hive, they will be unable to return to it.

 

[Sutty]

That’s what I have read. Which suggested that the LW are predominantly house bee’s that if shaken out a distance from the hive will be unable to return as they haven’t been outside and have not oriented. So they will basically be lost in what will be a wilderness to them.
It makes sense that if they have never left the hive, they will be unable to return to it.

Except that they have been shown to make orientation flights I think from day 3 after emergence.

 

[BeeBird]

Except that they have been shown to make orientation flights I think from day 3 after emergence.

Wow really. I would be interested to read the literature about that if you have any links/references? please

 

[Sutty]

Some stuff here
https://theapiarist.org/orientation-flights/

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

That’s what I have read. Which suggested that the LW are predominantly house bees

that may be what you have read, but whoever wrote that nonsense was talking absolute nonsense, bees can, and will fly from a very early age, and they take orientation flights as soon as possible - or do you think they just hold it all in and not take toilet breaks until they become foragers?

 

[BeeBird]

that may be what you have read, but whoever wrote that nonsense was talking absolute nonsense, bees can, and will fly from a very early age, and they take orientation flights as soon as possible - or do you think they just hold it all in and not take toilet breaks until they become foragers?

Yeah I realise that bee’s fly in order to take a comfort break, but the question is how far away is the toilet I don’t go to the upstairs facilities if I can use the one’s downstairs .
Seriously though, what beekeeping publications are out there that have any credibility or are they just full of unproven and subjective waffle?

 

[jarmo henttu]

There are always laying workers in the hive If everything looked good last time you inspected (and that was recently), then I'd guess that there's nothing to worry about, but see what happens with your test frame.

James

Laying workers are not always in the hive. Sometimes one out million in queen right colony. But it they are, policing bees destroy the eggs in 24 hours.