Laying workers or new queen?

[Stephibee]

Are there multiple eggs in the queen cups?

Yes, I could only see eggs in one but it contained 3.

 

[Michael Palmer]

With multiple eggs in the queen cups I would say LW.

 

[Stephibee]

With multiple eggs in the queen cups I would say LW.

That's what I fear

 

[pete darbyshire]

The bees currentky cover around 3 frames.

The swarm was huge so I was (at the time of collecting, now I'm questioning myself) quite sure that it was a prime.

Last Friday, this was a reasonable swarm, and would not fit in a nuc. (Mc Donalds carpark.) It covered 11 frames in a national brood and the (mated) queen had laid on 3 frames within 24 hours.
Sometimes a flying swarm looks bigger than it actually is.

 

[Hebeegeebee]

That's what I fear

A mated queen will be laying withing a few days. If you are unsure, you can always pop in a frame of brood (inc eggs and young larvae) after a week or so and see what happens. The brood will inhibit laying workers if there is no queen and will indicate whether there is a queen present or not.

 

[oliver90owner]

“Huge”, “three frames”. Something tells me that the swarm was not collected - just some of it.

Was the box, it was collected in, left for the swarm to join the queen? I think not. I am guessing the bees would have retuned to their queen if left for a while. Without some sensible details we are just guessing - even to whether the bees were collected from outside or the inside of the bin.

So my guess (‘cos that is all it can be) is laying workers. A week, or less, will show if these are sporadic layings with no pattern and drone brood. I expect it to be so.

 

[Stephibee]

Update: Went in today and a lot of drone comb but what appears to be some capped workers? Almost all the eggs are now singlular, the occasional duo could still be found. 1 supercedure cell and 1 playcup/beginning of a second supercedure cell.

My plan is to leave them with ample sugar syrup and see if they can successfully requeen but if possible, I have a couple of questions.

Does anyone know why they are laying so much drone?
Was the mating flight unsuccessful?
Is what I'm assuming capped workers, actually that?

Thank you in advance for any helpful responses I attached photos.

 

[Erichalfbee]

Update: Went in today and a lot of drone comb but what appears to be some capped workers? Almost all the eggs are now singlular, the occasional duo could still be found. 1 supercedure cell and 1 playcup/beginning of a second supercedure cell.

My plan is to leave them with ample sugar syrup and see if they can successfully requeen but if possible, I have a couple of questions.

Does anyone know why they are laying so much drone?
Was the mating flight unsuccessful?
Is what I'm assuming capped workers, actually that?

Thank you in advance for any helpful responses I attached photos.

Those are laying workers and the queen cells are dud.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Those are laying workers and the queen cells are dud.

colony is doomed, shake them out.

 

[hemo]

The laying pattern is awful and typical of LW's.

 

[Stephibee]

Terrible news Thanks everyone.
I'll try and merge them with one of my other hives.

Does anyone know why some of the brood comb is flat? Just wondering out of interest.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Terrible news Thanks everyone.
I'll try and merge them with one of my other hives.

Does anyone know why some of the brood comb is flat? Just wondering out of interest.

It just appears 'flat' because the bees have raised the comb to accommodate the larger larvae. If you get a whole frame of drone brood (which sometimes happens with a DLQ) on first appearances it just looks like a frame of worker brood

 

[Erichalfbee]

Terrible news Thanks everyone.
I'll try and merge them with one of my other hives.

Does anyone know why some of the brood comb is flat? Just wondering out of interest.

Only if you have a big strong colony. Even then there’s a chance it won’t work.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Only if you have a big strong colony. Even then there’s a chance it won’t work.

far safer to shake them out in front of the other hives

 

[Stephibee]

Only if you have a big strong colony. Even then there’s a chance it won’t work.

What happens if it doesn't work? Do they split back off, or will they kill the other hives queen?

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

What happens if it doesn't work? Do they split back off, or will they kill the other hives queen?

they will kill the queen

 

[Erichalfbee]

What happens if it doesn't work? Do they split back off, or will they kill the other hives queen?

And be mindful where they are in the apiary before you shake them out. Likely most will head for the hive nearest where they were. If that’s a nuc it might be overwhelmed.

 

[Kaz]

Update: Went in today and a lot of drone comb but what appears to be some capped workers? Almost all the eggs are now singlular, the occasional duo could still be found. 1 supercedure cell and 1 playcup/beginning of a second supercedure cell.

My plan is to leave them with ample sugar syrup and see if they can successfully requeen but if possible, I have a couple of questions.

Does anyone know why they are laying so much drone?
Was the mating flight unsuccessful?
Is what I'm assuming capped workers, actually that?

Thank you in advance for any helpful responses I attached photos.

I've just had exactly the same thing with a swarm rescued from a hedge, first inspection found laying workers caught in the act! There were 8 or so on this frame, all sitting around up to their armpits as if they were in the hot tub at a spa day. Some of the eggs, as with yours, beautifully laid as single eggs in the bottom of the cell

 

[Boston Bees]

I've just had exactly the same thing with a swarm recurred from a hedge, first inspection found laying workers caught in the act! There were 8 or so on this frame, all sitting around up to their armpits as if they were in the hot tub at a spa day. Some of the eggs, as with yours, beautifully laid as single eggs in the bottom of the cell

Great photo! Little blighters .....

 

[pargyle]

I've just had exactly the same thing with a swarm rescued from a hedge, first inspection found laying workers caught in the act! There were 8 or so on this frame, all sitting around up to their armpits as if they were in the hot tub at a spa day. Some of the eggs, as with yours, beautifully laid as single eggs in the bottom of the cell

That's a great photo ...and you can clearly see where there are at least a couple of eggs in some cells ... what camera did you use to get that good a photo ?