Keeping the Bees warm

[herefordshirehoney]

Some interesting data so far from the arnia trial bee hive monitors i've had installed for a few weeks. They have to fly leads to monitor the brood nest's temp.

On my swienty langstroth poly hives (currently with wooden crown board on as a poly super as still feeding syrup, rest all poly though).

The results are the brood nest is 32-33.2 averaging 33.1o C, this is a constant temp it doesn't change at all. Would be interested in seeing these results for a wooden hive.

 

[itma]

R2, yes I didnt have rads so installed 13 double panel rads at 30% oversize. All pipework is 22mm except where it shows. Works on higher volume / lower temperature.
We buried 400m of pipe 1.6m down, across the lawn, between the raised veg beds, under the willow hedge and out into the field. It could have been installed all under the lawn laying the pipe 'slinky' style but a long continuous loop is far more efficient. Bore holes are very efficient too.
Pete D

Temperature is the enemy.
The more you uplift the temperature (loop->ch) with the heat pump the more the efficiency drops off. Which is why its better underfloor (~35C) rather than in rads (~50C). Bigger rads (and pipes) are needed to get away with cooler circulated water. And not much CoP (technical pun there) for heating domestic hot water to 60C ...

The collector works better in damp soil. Should be good in the Fens!

 

[itma]

Some interesting data so far from the arnia trial bee hive monitors i've had installed for a few weeks. They have to fly leads to monitor the brood nest's temp.

On my swienty langstroth poly hives (currently with wooden crown board on as a poly super as still feeding syrup, rest all poly though).

The results are the brood nest is 32-33.2 averaging 33.1o C, this is a constant temp it doesn't change at all. Would be interested in seeing these results for a wooden hive.

I'd be interested to learn some detail of exactly where the temp probes are. What happens with prop? What temperature disruption have you seen after an inspection?
Keen to know more!

 

[user 6228]

Some interesting data so far from the arnia trial bee hive monitors i've had installed for a few weeks. They have to fly leads to monitor the brood nest's temp.

On my swienty langstroth poly hives (currently with wooden crown board on as a poly super as still feeding syrup, rest all poly though).

The results are the brood nest is 32-33.2 averaging 33.1o C, this is a constant temp it doesn't change at all. Would be interested in seeing these results for a wooden hive.

You will get the same results in a wooden hive for a probe on comb.

temps are only part of the story... There also:

• the heat output required to generate the heat.
• The number of bees required to insulate and maintain temp around the brood.

and so on.

To gain a understanding of how the box is contributing you need to measure where bees are not. i.e. the hive wall inside surface temperature and bee space air temperatures.

 

[herefordshirehoney]

I'd be interested to learn some detail of exactly where the temp probes are. What happens with prop? What temperature disruption have you seen after an inspection?
Keen to know more!

These are placed in the middle of the brood frames (two separate probes) about 2 frames apart in the middle of the comb (roughly not an exact since as it moves slightly). I havent seen any temp changes in temp when I look the next day after an inspection probably as there able to raise the temp that quickly.

The slave unit which is placed on the outside of the hive has its own temp and is reading the external temp. I believe it gathers the data every hour. This then send the data back to a master unit that again has its own external temp which sends the data back to their servers every night. Also does the 500hz with microphone spectrum graphs.

 

[itma]

...
To gain a understanding of how the box is contributing you need to measure where bees are not. i.e. the hive wall inside surface temperature and bee space air temperatures.

These are placed in the middle of the brood frames (two separate probes) about 2 frames apart in the middle of the comb (roughly not an exact since as it moves slightly). I havent seen any temp changes in temp when I look the next day after an inspection probably as there able to raise the temp that quickly.

The slave unit which is placed on the outside of the hive has its own temp and is reading the external temp. ...

Thanks!

I suspect that the large quantity of stores present at this point will act as a heat reservoir and 'slug' any changes.
Measuring the hive airspace temperature is likely to show more dramatic changes with hive opening, and different recovery rates for different thermal performance hives (poly vs wood).

 

[herefordshirehoney]

I suspect that the large quantity of stores present at this point will act as a heat reservoir and 'slug' any changes.
Measuring the hive airspace temperature is likely to show more dramatic changes with hive opening, and different recovery rates for different thermal performance hives (poly vs wood).

You'd be correct stores either side of the nest so could indeed be store the thermal temp.

The probes are loose and free floating however - the bees do like to glue it to the sides ive already noticed sometimes including the cables which is interesting to say the least.

As the probes are able to move I can move them about and measure this, probably not worth doing this time of year as id rather leave them alone but in spring nothing stopping me playing then.

 

[Poly Hive]

All done by Jefferies in the mid 1950's. He concluded that there is an optimum colony size for wintering and creating super colonies does not help in fact quite the reverse. From memory he united four together for the experiments. They failed.

PH

 

[madasafish]

Seems that you nd I, BCB, are wrong.
Of course, the insulation could cause damp, not good for man nor BEE!

I suggest a basic grounding in physics and then a retraction is in order.

 

[E1M]

What?

 

[REDWOOD]

How about a bit of Biology, bees keep them self's warm as long as they have the energy to do it which they get from food, bees don't die of cold only starvation.

 

[simoncav]

Why all the messing about?

I'm chuckling at these people who go to great lengths to cover their wooden hives with various materials to insulate their bees over winter.

Its very simple - Just buy Poly hives and stop b*ggering about...

 

[psafloyd]

I'm chuckling at these people who go to great lengths to cover their wooden hives with various materials to insulate their bees over winter.

Its very simple - Just buy Poly hives and stop b*ggering about...

So, poly has no drawbacks, then?

 

[VEG]

I'm chuckling at these people who go to great lengths to cover their wooden hives with various materials to insulate their bees over winter.

Its very simple - Just buy Poly hives and stop b*ggering about...

Or just use a wooden hive without any insulation

 

[REDWOOD]

Or just use a wooden hive without any insulation

and a descent thickness crownboard and roof not the thin rubbish you buy in beekeeping shops

 

[Poly Hive]

I've been looking for over twenty years but not found one draw back yet. Discovered a lot of pluses though. LOLOL

PH

 

[Elaine]

How about a bit of Biology, bees keep them self's warm as long as they have the energy to do it which they get from food, bees don't die of cold only starvation.

Or put the other way around - if the bees don't have to work so hard to keep themselves warm, thay don't need to consume so much fuel - so saving thier own stores - or the amount that the beek has to supply