Is it too late to add a frame of drone foundation?

[jeff33]

Hi, I will be fumigating one of my hive next week when the vaporiser arrives and I understand it only targets mites on emerging brood or adult bees and will not kill the others in cells.

So I my question is: Will the 3 treatment cycle over the next 3 weeks be sufficient to seriously weaken the mite population until treatment in autumn (if needed) or can I also add a frame of drone foundation or is it too late? I have a few drones already appearing. Thanks

 

[domino]

Hi, I will be fumigating one of my hive next week when the vaporiser arrives and I understand it only targets mites on emerging brood or adult bees and will not kill the others in cells.

So I my question is: Will the 3 treatment cycle over the next 3 weeks be sufficient to seriously weaken the mite population until treatment in autumn (if needed) or can I also add a frame of drone foundation or is it too late? I have a few drones already appearing. Thanks

If they have lots of mites why not do a shook swarm? Pop some open brood in - wait for it to be sealed and then remove the frame.

 

[bpmurray]

If they have lots of mites why not do a shook swarm? Pop some open brood in - wait for it to be sealed and then remove the frame.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Hi, I will be fumigating one of my hive next week when the vaporiser arrives and I understand it only targets mites on emerging brood or adult bees and will not kill the others in cells.

So I my question is: Will the 3 treatment cycle over the next 3 weeks be sufficient to seriously weaken the mite population until treatment in autumn (if needed) or can I also add a frame of drone foundation or is it too late? I have a few drones already appearing. Thanks

You will be doing a three week cycle of sublimation which will cover the whole cycle of brood (as far as is needed) so that should be enough. If anything it's too early to put in a sacrificial frame and expect bees to draw it and be laid up in the crepe weather we've had. Anyway - the only time I'd encourage drone harvesting is if the person had rubbish bees - just to ensure there's not many of his drones around.
An interesting theory was put forward in the convention by a grizzed old beekeeper - everyone is moaning about poor queen matings/failed matings the last few years, what do we need for good mating? plenty of drones - what is everyone doing? sacrificing drone brood in a misguided attempt to control varoa instead of tackling the issue properly and depleting the drone population to dangerously low levels.

If they have lots of mites why not do a shook swarm? Pop some open brood in - wait for it to be sealed and then remove the frame.

Yeah - really good way of helping the colony go from strength to strength, shake em all out, kill all their brood, force them to work hard drawing comb in unsuitable weather conditions and then, when they get themselves sorted - kill some more brood!!

 

[jeff33]

You will be doing a three week cycle of sublimation which will cover the whole cycle of brood (as far as is needed) so that should be enough. If anything it's too early to put in a sacrificial frame and expect bees to draw it and be laid up in the crepe weather we've had. Anyway - the only time I'd encourage drone harvesting is if the person had rubbish bees - just to ensure there's not many of his drones around.
An interesting theory was put forward in the convention by a grizzed old beekeeper - everyone is moaning about poor queen matings/failed matings the last few years, what do we need for good mating? plenty of drones - what is everyone doing? sacrificing drone brood in a misguided attempt to control varoa instead of tackling the issue properly and depleting the drone population to dangerously low levels.





Yeah - really good way of helping the colony go from strength to strength, shake em all out, kill all their brood, force them to work hard drawing comb in unsuitable weather conditions and then, when they get themselves sorted - kill some more brood!!

I didn't want to go along the route of shook swarm for the moment. As stated by JB they just started to perk up so I don't want to deplete them of all the brood. I have had a look in the hive earlier as it is a toasty 15c in my back garden with no wind. I have 7 frames of brood in the deep an the super is almost jammed with brood, store and bees so I am banking on this hive to be productive. I have had to super it and move frames of nectar in the new super to make more space. I think I will just use sublimation. At this rate I may have to Demaree this one soon!!

 

[Poly Hive]

Why do you think you need to treat for Varroa now? Do you have a very heavy mite drop? Did you treat in autumn? Did you treat in Jan with oxalic?

PH

 

[jeff33]

Why do you think you need to treat for Varroa now? Do you have a very heavy mite drop? Did you treat in autumn? Did you treat in Jan with oxalic? PH

The mite count is pretty random, 1 day very high, 1 day low but its difficult to see on the board as it is soaked with dripping condensation. I treated with Apiguard in the autumn but no oxalic this winter as it was too mild here. First few drones I have seen are crippled with deformed wings so while I know mites go for drone brood over worker it makes me think it might be bad...the hive is looking really strong though. I cant keep doing a mite count week after week until I come to a constant average but then again I can't treat for no reason!

 

[Erichalfbee]

I cant keep doing a mite count week after week until I come to a constant average but then again I can't treat for no reason!

Then you need to do a proper mite count......Sugar roll or alcohol wash
I shall be doing two of mine fairly soon

 

[jeff33]

Then you need to do a proper mite count......Sugar roll or alcohol wash

Thanks, will get on the case, youtube might come in handy once more.

 

[Poly Hive]

Make sure it is a UK vid not from abroad.... makes an odds ya ken!

PH

 

[jeff33]

Make sure it is a UK vid not from abroad.... makes an odds ya ken!PH

I will stay away from the redneck for sure!

 

[BeeJayBee]

Thanks, will get on the case, youtube might come in handy once more.

No need for youtube, there are good enough pictures and descriptions on Randy Oliver's site. Sugar rolling doesn't kill the bees, alcohol wash does.

About 2/3 down this page http://scientificbeekeeping.com/fighting-varroa-reconnaissance-mite-sampling/

 

[beeno]

Yeah - really good way of helping the colony go from strength to strength, shake em all out, kill all their brood, force them to work hard drawing comb in unsuitable weather conditions and then, when they get themselves sorted - kill some more brood!!

Furthermore the colonies often do not produce any honey which is understandable.

 

[domino]

Furthermore the colonies often do not produce any honey which is understandable.

Interestingly from my experience last year where I shook swarmed about six hives apart from one they all built up pretty quickly and made honey. As in beekeeping everyone's' mileage varies.

 

[jeff33]

I can't bring myself to destroy 7-8 frames of brood. If they were crawling with mites and on the brink of collapsing fair enough but this is not the case.

 

[Millet]

I can't bring myself to destroy 7-8 frames of brood. If they were crawling with mites and on the brink of collapsing fair enough but this is not the case.

Me neither i find it much more satisfying to gas them with oxalic acid and see a pile of dead varroa on the inspection tray.

 

[BeeJayBee]

Interestingly from my experience last year where I shook swarmed about six hives apart from one they all built up pretty quickly and made honey. As in beekeeping everyone's' mileage varies.

Some people shook swarm their colonies every year at the first sign of queen cells. It gives a brood break which helps control mites, gets rid of any mite-infested larvae, and the colony is ready to build comb fast. None of them report a reduction in yield, in fact they say it improves yield.

I haven't tried it though, because it all seems counter-intuitive.

 

[Cussword]

Some people shook swarm their colonies.

I haven't tried it though, because it all seems counter-intuitive.

You do seem to have an excess of mites,, as suggested, a sugar roll test is the simplest (and less harmful to the bees) way to go. You could do that while waiting for your sublimator to arrive. Then, if it's needed, sublimation 3 times, 5 days apart, should bring things down to manageable levels.

All this has been said above.

Also you will see that a lot of the more experienced folk on here, treat yootoob like the plague, there could be a reason for that, you don't have to know anything to post on there.
Just use it for it's entertainment value


.

 

[Dougie Bee]

Hi Jeff33
Sorry yet another suggestion, If you are so worried about varroa why not just dust with icing sugar once a week for 4 weeks and then see what happens

 

[Cussword]

Hi Jeff33
Sorry yet another suggestion, If you are so worried about varroa why not just dust with icing sugar once a week for 4 weeks and then see what happens

Not quite as effective.