How do you make frames from scratch

[REDWOOD]

Whats the best way to make frames from timber and what power tools do I need ?

 

[oliver90owner]

Saw, planer and spindle moulder A table router (horizontal or vertical wiil do) can be sustituted for the spindle moulder. In fact a router can be the only item used, but that might mke the job just a little slower.

Best way? One suggestion might be:

Cut, plane, route, cut, route, I would think for side bars.

Cut, plane, cut, route, cut for top bars.

Cut, plane, cut for bottom bars.

Might depend on what type frame you wish to finish with. There may be more than one operation with the above order. Just depends - you really need to sort you own order of operations to suit your method of working (like routing multiples or singles); it may just depend on the machine(s) you have.

Never really thought about it too much - they are as 'cheap as chips' in the winter sales and when I have considered it, I have always gone for the factory made ones - for guaranteed swapping of parts when cleaned and sterilised for re-use.

 

[wightbees]

hope this makes sense

router and table saw or band saw will do

 

[For want of a better word]

Ok if you have a machine shop set up !

 

[wightbees]

If interested i will try a pic for top and bottom bars tomorrow.
These are only ideas to give you the basics on what to do.
Im sure you can get the drift of it and sort sizes out.

 

[Finman]

.
How do you make frames from scratch

Pieces of wood are better be good quality.

When frame wood has a knot, it will be aborted.
Knot will twist inside the hive

The wood, where you install the wires, it cannot be very soft. The wire will soak into wood when you tighten it. Hard scotch pine is good but pruce is too soft even here. Pruce in Central Europe is very soft.

 

[Finman]

Whats the best way to make frames from timber and what power tools do I need ?

You have 3 hives. You will manage with these kind of tools.

Very important is the settup systems how you lock the settups and take off.

[ame]http://www.amazon.co.uk/Table-Saws/s?ie=UTF8&rh=n%3A114657031&page=1[/ame]


I have 100 pounds table saw from Lidl. It is splended.

Wide side wings are usefull when you saw boards
[ame]http://www.amazon.co.uk/Draper-69122-230-Volt-500-Watt-Table/dp/B0002GV1D2/ref=sr_1_12?s=diy&ie=UTF8&qid=1330322915&sr=1-12[/ame]

 

[rae]

As Oliver90 says, I don't see the economic case.

You need some pretty big, quite high quality boards. If you want to do this slowly, you could get away with a router, or table saw, but some of the cuts will be quite precise, and actually quite dangerous - effectively you will doing dado cuts, so no riving knife etc. If you want to do it quickly, then a spindle moulder is the answer, but that is a big bit of kit.

Compared to all that, the few quid Thornes charge for the things seems like a bargain.

 

[Poly Hive]

I used to make top bars and manley side bars but frankly it is not worth the hassle and dust.

PH

 

[Finman]

As Oliver90 says, I don't see the economic case.

.

To make simple frames to backyard is very economic.
In UK price of frames are 3 fold compared to Finland and Sweden.
Your 10 frames cost more that 10 fame polybox.

The structure of UK frames are really comples.

A normal hive needs 50 frames. What is you price there?

Our 100 frame package is 42 pounds/ 50 euros. Made in Estonia.

I have read that in UK used frames is better to burn....

 

[rae]

It comes down to the value of your time. I can make a load of 14x12 broods in about 2 hours - time per box averages at about 10 minutes. Worth doing, given that boxes are £50.

The time taken to do frames would depend on the kit you have. With a spindle moulder + band saw and the right tooling, you could make them very fast. Worth doing, but why would you have £10,000 of tools to do this. With a router and/or a table saw, it would take a lot longer. It is not worth a morning of my week end to set up a router to make £20 of frames.

 

[oliver90owner]

My 14 x 12s cost 82p each (SN1's 48p?), plus the nails and my time to assemle Although some parts (around 2%, usually) need to be discarded (mainly top bars with cross-grain at the lugs) these are readily replaced from old frames.

So the frames are much cheaper to buy (flat pack) than the box they go into (unless one buys sales 'third' quality at heavily discounted rates).

Now if you want 'first' quality from the likes of Th8rne expect to pay a lot more. It is far more sensible (IMO) to buy cheap in the sales and store unused ones (even to throw away if never needed) than buying only what you need at the time as 'firsts' at maximum cost. There will be a 'cross-over point' on the economics dependent on how many hives you are working, of course.

If I were to order just one single pack of ten 14 x 12 frames from Th*rne today, with postage they would be costing me £2.63 for each frame (plus the nails and assembly time, on top). Compared to the 82p (as part of a bulk order exceeding £100) as seconds at sale time, you would have to be stupid or desparate to oder the ones costing £2.63 each! Making your own might then be an economic option, but again, anyone setting up to make just ten frames would be barmy IMO!

RAB

addition; my frames may have cost 84p each. Just can't remember and not going to search it out!

 

[wightbees]

a pair of side bars cost me 0.05 p
I have not worked out cost of top or bottom bars .
all I use is a router and bandsaw ,small tablesaw .
I rip about 200 ish at a time ,once you have done it you
have made jigs so setting up next time is a case of a few. minutes.

 

[Tim1606]

a pair of side bars cost me 0.05 p
I have not worked out cost of top or bottom bars .
all I use is a router and bandsaw ,small tablesaw .
I rip about 200 ish at a time ,once you have done it you
have made jigs so setting up next time is a case of a few. minutes.

Could you explain the jigs with perhaps a couple of pix?

 

[wightbees]

a basic jig but no messurements as they very to what you have in mind.
If you look at the first pic it outlays all the cuts,just make a plane of the sizes
you want.

 

[Finman]

It comes down to the value of your time. .

Yes, hanging in forum and giving advices how to make 1:1 sugar syrup and avoid dampness. Sure!

And that 100 000 £ machine is useless when you sit with your computer.

 

[Finman]

If I were to order just one single pack of ten 14 x 12 frames from Th*rne today, with postage they would be costing me £2.63 for each frame (plus the nails and assembly time, on top). Compared to the 82p (as part of a bulk order exceeding £100) as seconds at sale time, you would have to be stupid or desparate to oder the ones costing £2.63 each! Making your own might then be an economic option, but again, anyone setting up to make just ten frames would be barmy IMO!

!

Says the guy who has posts: 7,348 on forum.

Then you write "pollen coming in", "dead bee on roof". " not sugar- sugar syrup"

Why don't you make 100 frames?

 

[REDWOOD]

Thanks wightbee for the time and effort, I have got the idea now and it looks quite easy, I have a table saw and a router table, I will have a go this spring. what sort of wood do you use ? What I don't like is suppliers only sell frames in sets of 10 so to fill one hive you need to buy 2 sets errrr why is this, lets rip off beekeepers. Another thing is the over inflated postage, I have a royal mail business account and I worked out what suppliers charge to what I can post it and it is way over the top.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

What I don't like is suppliers only sell frames in sets of 10 so to fill one hive you need to buy 2 sets errrr why is this

Thank the EU that's metrication for you - not allowed to sell in dozens anymore!

 

[The Cumbrian]

Thank the EU that's metrication for you - not allowed to sell in dozens anymore!

It may come as a surprise to you but in theory Britain went metric in 1974.