Hive materials traditional wood?

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I know nothing about bee keeping. But I'm aware there are problems with bees which seem to be blamed on modern pesticides.

Question.

Over the last 30 or 20 years, different new materials are used for bee hives. Bee hives are painted, new materials are used.

Is it possible that problems are caused by these new materials and paints.

Is there evidence that traditional wood un painted beehives have healthier bees?

I'm sure the scientists have looked into this, if so, please point me to the research.

Seems to me, the problem might be the environment the bees are forced to live in.

That said, I doubt pesticides improve bee health.

My gut feeling is, bees should be housed in un painted wooden hives.

As stated no experience in bee keeping.

As others have said Cedar hives have been around a very long time and Polyhives have been around long enough.
Any paint / wood treatment used is generally very carefully chosen by beekeepers to NOT contain insecticide or any chemicals that we believe would be harmful to bees.

I really can't see where you are going with this thread other than trying to stir up responses. I'm afraid I suspect more that this is a 2nd login by someone that likes to wind up people on this forum!

You state not experience and then state you have a gut feeling, based on what?

Bumblebees are a different kind of bee, I read recently that the average UK garden has 2-3 bumblebee nests in it that normally go un-noticed. So you can't base much on the number of bumblebees in your garden compared to honey bees without knowing where any colonies of honey bees are in relation to your garden!
 
Sorry, I'm not intentionally winding anyone up and I'm not someone's second log in.

Can the moderators remove the entire thread please.
 
Seems like 'sussed' to me.

Who mentioned PVC?


I made it perfectly clear I don't know anything about bee keeping other than what little I have read.

I have a gut feeling that traditional methods and materials are often best and I have a natural suspicion of new materials and methods.

We all know what devastation has been caused by some pesticides and how some farming methods can exacerbate problems like mad cow, TB etc.

I asked some questions out of interest, perhaps I phrased them wrongly.

There was no intent to offend.
 
Seems like 'sussed' to me.

Who mentioned PVC?
I think the word polyhive was used and he thought the poster meant polyvinyl chloride, also known as PVC. Can't be sure though, you never know.

To the OP: Bees have a lot of worries: like varroa (most of all), other diseases (most made worse by varroa) pesticides and lack of forage, all well researched and sorry I'm not going to post a load of links. They live in anything from wooden cavities to brick buildings, straw steps, polystyrene hives etc etc. To my knowledge they can live a healthy life in all of these.

Never thought I would write this but READ up about this, then THINK.

Next thing likely to happen is you will want some bees, and they will really get you thinking.
 
Yep, but no PVC mentioned.

As an aside there are poly allsorts. Amide, ethylene, propylene, methyl methacrylate, styrene, carbonate, urethane, to name just a few.
 
I think the word polyhive was used and he thought the poster meant polyvinyl chloride, also known as PVC. Can't be sure though, you never know.

To the OP: Bees have a lot of worries: like varroa (most of all), other diseases (most made worse by varroa) pesticides and lack of forage, all well researched and sorry I'm not going to post a load of links. They live in anything from wooden cavities to brick buildings, straw steps, polystyrene hives etc etc. To my knowledge they can live a healthy life in all of these.

Never thought I would write this but READ up about this, then THINK.

Next thing likely to happen is you will want some bees, and they will really get you thinking.

From beebehaviour.com

""3. Usage of plastic frames, polystyrene hives, nucs and mininucs

Each year, several million plastic frames of various types are sold in the United States. For example, in 2006 alone, only one company, Betterbee, sold almost a million Pierco plastic frames. However, wide usage of plastic frames, polystyrene hives, nucs and mini-nucs dramatically reduces the quantity of propolis. My personal observation shows that polystyrene BeeMax hives with plastic Pierco frames cause the quantity of propolis to decrease by 75% in comparison to wooden hives with wooden frames.

Propolis provides several levels of protection. Firstly, it strengthens the structure of the hive. However, more importantly, propolis defends the hive from bacterial and viral infection, which can easily spread in large colonies of tens of thousands of bodies. In addition, according to an article posted on Syben, a UK bioscience network, "It is propolis that provides the bee colony with its immune protection system."

The article explains that "...propolis, a highly complex chemical package which can contain up to 300 different chemicals and has been found to have antibiotic, anti-inflammatory and anti-fungal properties." Propolis' protective properties come from the sap (collected from trees such as poplar, willow, horse chestnut and birch) that possesses antibiotic qualities that protect trees from infection. To produce propolis, bees gathered the sap, remetobolize it with nectar secretions, and subsequently carry it to the hive in order to share it with the other members of the colony.
Therefore, the decreased quantity of propolis in polystyrene hives or nucs, or in hives that use plastic frames, exposes colonies to increased levels of infection.

In addition, there is no research that shows whether plastic frames and hives contain chemicals that are dangerous for bees.""
 
I refuse to read anything from a new poster on this subject .First post.

Period.

No welcome, no nothing.

SO either a troll or a duplicate poster.

Edit:
and he joined today.. just to post!

(must think we are dumb)
 
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The bumble bees in my garden are doing really well but I've no idea where they nest.

Cedar has been used for 30 years you say and PVC for how long?

Are Cedric hives painted? What was used prior to cedar?

What possible reason would someone want to use PVC as opposed to wood, other than cheapness
?

No hives are produced as far as i know from PVC.
Expanded polystryrene is the usual material for foam hives although I use polyisocyanurate expanded with pentane. Solid wall hives are polyethylene, polypropylene and polyurethane.

Foam contructed hives are much better at insulating the bees to the level they would experience in tree nests, their original habitat.
Wooden hives constructed from cedar lose heat 4 to 7 times greater than than in typical tree nests .
In expanded Polystryene hives, this heat loss is typically half that of cedar wooden hives.
However, Western Red Cedar is one of the least thermally conductive woods.
 
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I refuse to read anything from a new poster on this subject .First post.

Period.

No welcome, no nothing.

SO either a troll or a duplicate poster.

Edit:
and he joined today.. just to post!

(must think we are dumb)

:iagree: :ban:
 
No hives are produced as far as i know from PVC.

I have seen some langstroth boxes made by " Bees forever" (UPVC same as your white plastic window frames ). Don't know about any other hive parts made by them or if they still make the boxes.
 
I have seen some langstroth boxes made by " Bees forever" (UPVC same as your white plastic window frames ). Don't know about any other hive parts made by them or if they still make the boxes.

Just googled them... U.S. company. Now that must be the most thermally conductive hive box I have seen yet.
http://beesforeverplastics.weebly.com/index.html

Material , lambda, thickness
PVC 0.19 0.003
Cedar 0.1 0.019
EPS 0.035 0.035
PIR 0.021 0.050
 
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I thought I should mention that only the outside is painted, the inside is left to the bees to do what they want.
 
I have a gut feeling that traditional methods and materials are often best and I have a natural suspicion of new materials and methods.

How far back do you want to go to find these 'traditional methods and materials'? Man has been keeping bees in artificial 'hives' for thousands of years, they can be made of clay, mud, tree stumps, straw, bits of scrap wood - anything that will 'contain' a colony and make it easy to harvest honey. Well, anything that's easier than chopping down a tree!

Cedar may (I'm guessing) originally have been used for hives in Europe (Britain) because a lot was coming from Canada at the beginning of 20th century - timber single storey houses etc., and there may have been a lot of spare wood that could be used for other purposes.

Being suspicious of new things isn't always sensible, some new materials can actually offer a good environment for bees - and people too.
 
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