Help !! - No Queen

[sean-a]

I got my first Nuc last July and the bees survived the winter.
I had a hive which was thriving in March, but the bees have gone quiet and I think that the queen has left, there is no brood and no eggs.

I found a small swarm on the lawn and encouraged them into the vacated nuc box, but again I think that there is no queen there either, I cant see one.

I have had no eggs for a few weeks (3 or 4) and no honey at all in the super.....

I have been edging the new swarm slowly across the lawn to where the other hive is a foot or so each day, and this seems to be fine.

And ideas where I go from here?

(I am near Stratford on Avon)

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Was your queen clipped.

Weere there any queen cells in the hive after you 'think' the queen left?
If so, did you do anything about those cells.
Why are you edging the nuked swarm across to the full hive?
People need a lot more information before they can make any kind of sense about what's happened, but as I'm bored I'll have a wild stab at it!

Your main hive has swarmed.
You say no eggs for 3 or 4 weeks - assuming that's the main hive there wouldn't be as you have to wait for new queen to emerge and get mated - early days yet.
If you haven't reduced the QC's to one open or two closed you will have had loads of virgin queens emerging and throwing cast swarms.
The small swarm you collected may well be either:
a) your (possibly clipped) original queen and her entourage - if you found that swarm four weeks ago.
b)One of the cast swarms from your original hive.
The nuc has no eggs as, being a cast swarm the queen hasn't mated yet
You'll have to wait quite a while before anything happens.

How often do you inspect?
How many bees left in the main hive?

 

[oliver90owner]

It would be helpful if you posted details of your inspections around the period you would like discussed.

Otherwise we can only guess wildly. Here's one: You didn't inspect for a month and then they have swarmed about three or four weeks ago followed by several cast swarms, the last only a couple weeks ago, so little surprise there is no brood in there. If I am. Completey right I would be surprised, but I doubt I am far off with some of it.

Was there honey in the super? Is it drawn? Is there honey in the brood? Why are you edging the small swarm across your lawn?

Seems like some patience applied may be a good way to go, but only guessing, on the facts supplied.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

snap!​

 

[sean-a]

I have not properly checked some of the central comb because I had not pushed the frames close enough together and the bees have built lots of wild comb attached to the walls of the hive (Omelet hive)

I did cut some of the wild comb out about a week ago, and there was a queen cell in it which unfortunately I destroyed in talking out some of the wild comb. There was a lavae in it about half a cm long!
I cant see any other queen cells in the hive, but there is still a bit of a mess of wild comb in the centre which I cant get to and I am hesitant in case there is a residual queen cell.

The comb in the supers is only partially drawn - very sparcely !

(I am moving the other swarm so I can put it into the other half of the omlet hive)

 

[TryingToLetThemBee]

A QC is brood so "no brood and no eggs" needs clarification.

 

[sean-a]

OK To clarify - There are no other eggs or capped or uncapped brood in the hive that I can see.
There were no other eggs or larvae in the wild comb that I removed - just a little bit of capped honey and mostly empty cells.

 

[oliver90owner]

that I can see.

Did not Nelson perform a trick like that. 'I see no ships' in his case?

You clearly have recent eggs, of that there seems little doubt.

The Dartington hive was never designed for maintaining two colonies in the one box - only for horizontal 'demaree', increase or a sort of artificial swarm, with a view or unification later. Is that your plan?

Much in agreement with JBM as usual.

Further questions might be why is there a super (or is this a half-super?) on the hive?

How can you tell if the colony were close to starvation?

How many bees are present?

I think the hive is in such a mess that it needs sorting out soonest. Hoffman frames are not called 'self-spacing' for no good reason!

Have you tried the omlette forum? Great load of guys over there. Offering advice on that specific hive type Might even get a response from OSH if she still frequents that forum....

 

[enrico]

With the situation as RAB describes, you need help. Get someone else to come round with a brood box that wil take your frames. Move all your frames out of your hive, clean it up, replace the frames that have been correctly spaced and fill with new ones. At the same time look at the state of each frame as you take it out. If you have no eggs then, in advance, ask your helper to bring a frame of eggs. This should get you going again. I think this has been a big learning curve for you. You desperately need someone to get you back on the right path.
E

 

[ratcatcher]

I did cut some of the wild comb out about a week ago,

so you couldn't be bothered to do weekly checks and care for the bees, but you were quick enough to cut some wild comb out, presumably for the honey?
did they have enough stores at this point, or was that not a worry?

 

[sean-a]

Gosh a pretty hostile response to a request for help !

I cut the comb out to try and tidy up the hive with the intention of trying to tie it back into an empty frame actually, not for the honey. I have tied it into a frame and put it into the nuc box with the small swarm.

As for stores - I dont know whether they have enough but I have taken no honey at all from the hive either this year or last and I have been providing them with some sugar syrup when it has been wet.

I have been looking in on the hive, but not wanted to cut out the comb too early.

 

[johnnie1uk]

"Gosh a pretty hostile response to a request for help"
Take no notice he probably hasn't had his second cup of coffee yet!

 

[ratcatcher]

Gosh a pretty hostile response to a request for help !

"Gosh a pretty hostile response to a request for help"
Take no notice he probably hasn't had his second cup of coffee yet!

forgive me, Im more for the bees than the honey, but it does come across as too little too late

 

[Dogged]

Hi Sean - I feel for your panic. Do you have another beek you can call on? Just getting another and more experienced pair of eyes on the situation can be a massive help. If you don't know anyone then find your local beekeepers association (online from BBKA website) and put out a mayday call. No point in losing sleep and possibly your bees by struggling on alone.

 

[sean-a]

Thanks for your replies.
I have joined the local Bee Keepers association, so I will try them too.

I do know that I have not got it right so far, but we all have to start somewhere!

 

[Pyritte]

I'm sorry but is this forum for new bee keepers, or not? When you start anything you make mistakes, not intentional but mistakes. I thought this forum was for help and advise most of the above comments are not helpful. Asking for more information so that you can help can be done in a nice way!!!

 

[Erichalfbee]

I'm sorry but is this forum for new bee keepers. When you start anything you make mistakes, not intentional but mistakes. I thought this forum was for help and advise

It is but it's assumed that a certain amount of research is done first...reading, joining a BKA and doing a course rather than just buying bees and "keeping" with no knowledge of husbandry. It seems that a not insignificant number do just that.

 

[Pyritte]

Maybe some do that but just criticising some one does not help them or the bees. I have done a course, read books and joined the BKA, but my bees haven't!
You come on a forum like this because YOU have made a mistake and need advice/ help because you know its the bees that are suffering from your inexperience!

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

But it does help if as much information is given as possible so that we can actually help and know how to pitch the answer - not guess what has happened

 

[enrico]

Maybe some do that but just criticising some one does not help them or the bees. I have done a course, read books and joined the BKA, but my bees haven't!
You come on a forum like this because YOU have made a mistake and need advice/ help because you know its the bees that are suffering from your inexperience!

Understand totally where you are coming from. Some of us answer gently and with experience, some reply mor curtly with actual facts, some reply with where to get help and suggest places that you yourself can find it. Wether you believe it or not we are trying to help and it is up to you to chose which replies you take note of and which you don't. It helps if you don't criticise too much those that you don't accept, some people find those very replies useful.
Hope this helps you to get the most out of the forum. I enjoy passing on my experience to others but am constantly surprised how many of the things I have believed for thirty years are wrong and how much I still learn every day from comments that are made here. I hope you accept that not all of us are articulate but many of us have knowledge and experience from which you can learn!
All the best
Eric