HELP Bees swarming post A/S --- No QC, either ???

[shudderdun]

Did an A/S on 26th June, all went well, put two frames of empty drawn cone in and filled the rest with foundation, then put one super on top with pleanty of honey in.

Q started laying again in small section of freshly drawn cone when I checked on 1st July, also still plenty of honey in super for them.

On Friday (5th July) about 1.30pm, the bees decided to swarm, caught the swarm and put them back with a QE under BB.

Checked, there were no QC,s, but did notice half a dozen drone cells in super and some pollen, also several small new Q cups in both BB and super, I then broke these up.

One hour later they swarmed again, caught swarm and put it back a second time, Q was with the swarm, she was marked, so I know, she is only small and must have got through the QE.

QE is pretty new and cant see any damage.

I was told to remove the super and start feeding syrup, which I did on Friday.

Think it was suggested, they dont think they dont have space to lay, not sure as I was up the wall by this time and may not have heared correctly. They also dont seem to want to draw any more foundation.

Anyway, yesterday, Saturday, bees swarmed again, but this time returned, think this may have been because Q couldnt get through QE this time.

Sunday, QE still on, cant leave it on much longer I dont think?

What do I do next to stop them swarming.

NOTE.
When I put them back the seecond time, as I said Q was still there, but I didnt see her go in, it all happened so fast, she was there one second and gone the next. I am assuming she was, because the swarm returned the third time and am not sure. Would they not have wanted to swarm if Q wasnt there anyway ?

Can someone PLEASE offer some advice what to do next.

Thanks.

 

[nikca]

I think you need to put down exactly how you did the A/S... there seem to be some mistakes. The first thing that springs to mind is that you didn't put a frame of BIAS in the new part of the A/S. Having brood present makes the queen less likely to leave and abandon brood.

 

[shudderdun]

I think you need to put down exactly how you did the A/S... there seem to be some mistakes. The first thing that springs to mind is that you didn't put a frame of BIAS in the new part of the A/S. Having brood present makes the queen less likely to leave and abandon brood.

Hi Nikca, you right I didnt, this was only the second time I have done an A/S, the first time I did put two frames of BIAS in with the original Q and they started to make QC,s. then I watched a video on Youtube and they didnt, so I didnt.

What do you suggest ?

 

[Ivor Kemp]

Agree with nikca.

Did you include a frame of brood when you did your AS?

My inclination now is that if they have come back after swarming to leave well alone now. Or if they swarm again try a new hive with above and new frames.

 

[oliver90owner]

Hi Nikca, you right I didnt,

So absconding, not swarming?

Surprising, if so. I might suspect there is another queen in there somewhere, but that seems out of the question, unless there were queen cells in the super fitted?.

I suppose the 'queen colony' was placed on a new site as well?

Oh well, I'll go for a virgin trapped in the super and the old queen below.

 

[shudderdun]

There is only one Q.

I put the old Q in a new hive in the original position, with the fresh and drawn foundation.

Any other suggestions what to do.

I wont be able to get around to then until later today, 2pm.

Thanks.

 

[beeno]

Hi Shudderdon,
Very interesting indeed. You did A/S on 26 June and first swarm attempt 5th July exactly 9 days later! IMHO strong chance that they made a QC which you missed. I cannot remember previous thread, but I take it you A/S because of QCs? They swarm with brood frame too, so don't beat yourself up on that score.

 

[beeno]

Hi Shudderdun,
Sorry hadn't finished posting. What to do next? If you remove QX they will swarm for sure. If you listen by the hive any piping going on? That would confirm that you have a virgin in there. Another A/S to remove queen from present situation or caging her with some attendants for a few days? I guess if we are saying that they are swarming they should not have been put back in the same hive - that's the mistake. Come on pros what's your solution?

 

[shudderdun]

Beeno,

Yes I did the AS because of QC, I am pretty sure there is no second Q.

As Oliver has now pointed out, they absconded, as there were only a hand full of bees left in the hive as I was returning the swarm.