Guidance pls

[o65]

Brand new beekeeper, just took my first swarm , left in a nuc for 48hrs to settle , when I transferred to hive , seems like the swarm is half of what it was.also I couldnt see the Queen.
Im leaving it a week before I check again, but looking for advice . Could the Queen be gone altogether, if so what advice would anyone give.

Thanks in advance

 

[Beefriendly]

Sit back relax and see what happens. Hopefully you should be pleasantly surprised.

 

[Millet]

Brand new beekeeper, just took my first swarm , left in a nuc for 48hrs to settle , when I transferred to hive , seems like the swarm is half of what it was.also I couldnt see the Queen.
Im leaving it a week before I check again, but looking for advice . Could the Queen be gone altogether, if so what advice would anyone give.

Thanks in advance

As per Beefriendly sit back and relax, you have one chance in roughly 20 thousand of spotting virgin Queen that is if you want to be anal and say 20.001 bees..or if a boffin pops up and says forty thousands bees then you do the maths ( i did not do school) enjoy if they start piling pollen in..

 

[o65]

Sit back relax and see what happens. Hopefully you should be pleasantly surprised.

Will do... Thanks

 

[o65]

As per Beefriendly sit back and relax, you have one chance in roughly 20 thousand of spotting virgin Queen that is if you want to be anal and say 20.001 bees..or if a boffin pops up and says forty thousands bees then you do the maths ( i did not do school) lol.

Thanks for the advice

 

[enrico]

But don't forget to let us know what happens. People often forget to tell us the outcome!
E

 

[pargyle]

Brand new beekeeper, just took my first swarm , left in a nuc for 48hrs to settle , when I transferred to hive , seems like the swarm is half of what it was.also I couldnt see the Queen.
Im leaving it a week before I check again, but looking for advice . Could the Queen be gone altogether, if so what advice would anyone give.

Thanks in advance

Prime swarm queens are notoriously difficult to find as they are slimmed down prior to swarming so they can fly better. If it's a caste (secondary swarm) it will be headed up with a virgin so she won't lay until she's mated.

Best advice .. let them get on with it for a week or so .. then check for eggs or larvae. Queen finding (unless there is a REAL need to find her) is a vastly overrated pastime - if there's eggs and brood - there's usually a laying queen - move on.

 

[o65]

Update.....im no expert but....there was practically zero activity around the hive this morning..........so I opened up and lo and behold theres about 50 bees looking very docile.its 4 days since i last checked.......they have started drawing out on the foundation , but im inclined to think theres no queen........cannot see her at all...im a bit gutted , not quite sure what to do next

 

[pargyle]

Update.....im no expert but....there was practically zero activity around the hive this morning..........so I opened up and lo and behold theres about 50 bees looking very docile.its 4 days since i last checked.......they have started drawing out on the foundation , but im inclined to think theres no queen........cannot see her at all...im a bit gutted , not quite sure what to do next

50 honey bees is not a viable colony .. when you collected the swarm did you make sure you got the queen in the box ? Did you leave them until after dark to relocate them to your apiary ? How far away from your apiary was the swarm collected ?

If you did not get the queen in the swarm and it was close to your apiary your bees would sniff out the queen and return to the spot where she was ..

Swarms will often abscond from their new home if they don't like it but they normally ALL go ... they don't leave a few behind.

Sounds like your colony is doomed anyway ...

 

[drex]

If these are the only bees you have, with only 50 bees, they are a write off, sorry. If you have another colony, and are sure they are queenless you could unite. Do not know if I would bother with that even just for 50 bees
Pargyle is obviously a quicker typist than me

 

[o65]

When I collected swarm , I left nothing but a few stragglers behind. Left in my nuc for 48 hrs, about 2 miles from where I got them......I was advised to leave the nuc open so the queen could fly and mate ( mistake??)........when I transferred to my hive I already had concerns, as it seemed as if many were not there, and couldnt see Queen...so I left for 4 days untill today ....live and learn I suppose

 

[Beefriendly]

not quite sure what to do next

Get another swarm or buy a nuc with a laying queen.
Whatever has happened it doesn't look good, 50 bees is not really viable. Do you have other hives nearby? I ask because if queenless and broodless bees will abscond to nearby hives that have queens. They have no reason to stay and this may possibly explain the steady reduction to nowt you are seeing.

 

[o65]

Theres a building close by that has a history of bees in the cavities on a regular basis, as many as 13 colonies (hotel)........thats a real possibilty they they have joined those ones.....anyhow hasnt put me off in the slightest, im in it for the long haul

 

[pargyle]

It may be that your perception of the size of the swarm was bigger than it actually was ... is it possible that it was the remnants of a swarm that another beekeeper had already collected and left behind far too many stragglers that you thought was a proper swarm ?

The other possibility is that it was a very small cast ie: a swarm headed by a virgin that left after the prime swarm (actually there are names for afterswarms that leave after the prime swarm - the first is Cast, the rest I can't remember !). The subsequent swarms get smaller and smaller as the colony reduces so you may have picked up a real runt ...

The size of the swarm will always reduce until the queen starts laying and new brood emerges but it sounds to me like there was something fundamentally flawed with your swarm in the first place ... look for another .. but they ain't gonna do much this year ! Remember the adage... a swarm in July is not worth a fly ... that's because they won't have time to produce a honey harvest. If you can't beg or buy a full functioning colony you may well be better to wait until next spring to start ... time to read, build, consider and generally get things up together ..

 

[o65]

I believe it was a very small caste....they were in a tree for two days ..thanks for all the advice

 

[pargyle]

I believe it was a very small caste....they were in a tree for two days ..thanks for all the advice

Hmmm ... after two days they would have exhausted the honey they gorged on prior to swarming - surviving for two days and then drawing a bit of comb ... I suspect you did not feed them ? They may well have had a poor chance of survival or large numbers have begged their way into other colonies if the queen was not there ...

 

[Beefriendly]

Hmmm ... after two days they would have exhausted the honey they gorged on prior to swarming - surviving for two days and then drawing a bit of comb ... I suspect you did not feed them ?

Come on Pargyle, standard advice to not feed a new swarm for three days or so. Not always right if they have been sat undecided for a few days as these were..an easy thing to get wrong. Not something to castigate someone over.

 

[pargyle]

Come on Pargyle, standard advice to not feed a new swarm for three days or so. Not always right if they have been sat undecided for a few days....but a good rule of thumb. Not something to castigate someone over.

Yes, generally speaking ... But I was not castigating, you know me better than that - I save castigation for Finnie not new beekeepers !! .. Knowing a swarm had been sat in the tree for two days I would be thinking about feeding a day or so after they were hived. As a small colony they would probably have appreciated a couple of litres of 1:1 syrup ...

The only reason not to feed is for them to use the honey reserves in comb building (and reduce the chance of any embedded disease being introduced into the new colony) ... although I personally am not sure whether this is yet another beekeeping 'myth' ? I've never seen any research or evidence of its veracity.

 

[o65]

Hey guys I dont feel castigated ......i was told though not to feed , and just leave them ........it was just my observation of lack of activity that got me worried.....im grateful for all the nuggets and opinions

 

[Beefriendly]

colony) ... although I personally am not sure whether this is yet another beekeeping 'myth' ? I've never seen any research or evidence of its veracity.

That I will agree with...as with changing comb when it gets black because it harbors disease.