Feeding and this weather

[stoneleighhouse]

the weathers wet and blustery the bees are busy when they can be(?) BUT
what about the feeding could they be consuming more stores than they are producing?
This warm no fly weather is forecast to last another week then its November and the days are getting shorter and theres less and less forage pre the first frost
Ok we can heft the hive but not a good time to go in there and check
Already fed 24lbs + sugar per hive
Yes I know theres always something to whittle about
I'm carrying on with the feeding for another few days
Whats the view?

 

[TryingToLetThemBee]

Quite well discussed in current thread here http://www.beekeepingforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=26893

 

[oliver90owner]

BUTwhat about the feeding could they be consuming more stores than they are producing?

Let's be clear. Bees will not forage unless the outcome is favourable to them. They are not stupid in that respect. What might be foraged could be different - pollen replacing honey per eg.

The main difference on stores is the amount of brooding taking place - larvae are very likely consuming more than the nectar foraged at this time and the brood nest temperature has to be maintained. And old bees are dying off, to be replaced by new winter bees.

One plus might be that the winter bees have a shorter time to survive from now until spring expansion starts.... Of course, weather patterns might make a joke of the best plans, come the springtime.

The only fixed plan I have is to wait and see if they need extra feeding in the winter. That will depend on stores levels when they finally cluster and settle down for the winter.

RAB

 

[For want of a better word]

Already fed 24lbs + sugar per hive ....and another 24 lbs to go I trust?

 

[Arfermo]

As for bees not having enough stores to get through winter, that is not a problem as dollops of syrup or fondant will take of that. What is of most concern to me is that, if the queen stopped or diminished her laying when the Apiguard was on (4 weeks from mid Aug), there may not be enough longlived and fit young bees to carry them through the winter if they are wearing themselves out foraging as is the case at the moment - and it might get worse some say if we have nice warm conditions through November!!! Worrying? Best to assume the bees know what they are up to I reckon - and I'm not going to look in and disturb them just to see nothing much either.

 

[Stiffy]

BUTwhat about the feeding could they be consuming more stores than they are producing?

Let's be clear. Bees will not forage unless the outcome is favourable to them. They are not stupid in that respect. What might be foraged could be different - pollen replacing honey per eg.

The main difference on stores is the amount of brooding taking place - larvae are very likely consuming more than the nectar foraged at this time and the brood nest temperature has to be maintained. And old bees are dying off, to be replaced by new winter bees.

One plus might be that the winter bees have a shorter time to survive from now until spring expansion starts.... Of course, weather patterns might make a joke of the best plans, come the springtime.

The only fixed plan I have is to wait and see if they need extra feeding in the winter. That will depend on stores levels when they finally cluster and settle down for the winter.

RAB

Between showers mine are foraging well at present and a quick check found they are storing the majority of it. I fed shortly after taking supers off and found a couple that chose to ignore it. My guess is that they were finding a better source than I offered, which is fine by me.
I plan to check them again when the weather finally decides to settle down for winter and if necessary top-up with some fondant but at present I am happy to let them get on with it.
S

 

[Norton]

Already fed 24lbs + sugar per hive ....and another 24 lbs to go I trust?

These would be your supereconomic AMM type of bees then.

 

[madasafish]

These would be your supereconomic AMM type of bees then.

 

[Gilberdyke John]

As for bees not having enough stores to get through winter, that is not a problem as dollops of syrup or fondant will take of that. What is of most concern to me is that, if the queen stopped or diminished her laying when the Apiguard was on (4 weeks from mid Aug), there may not be enough longlived and fit young bees to carry them through the winter if they are wearing themselves out foraging as is the case at the moment - and it might get worse some say if we have nice warm conditions through November!!! Worrying? Best to assume the bees know what they are up to I reckon - and I'm not going to look in and disturb them just to see nothing much either.

Mine stopped laying but once the treatment was over started again. Judging by the orientation flight numbers and the air transport flights plus views through the clear crown boards all the colonies should be in good shape for the winter.

 

[Stiffy]

These would be your supereconomic AMM type of bees then.

May my words be as sweet as honey, for tomorrow I may need to eat them.............very true

 

[rugbee]

BUTwhat about the feeding could they be consuming more stores than they are producing?

Let's be clear. Bees will not forage unless the outcome is favourable to them. They are not stupid in that respect. What might be foraged could be different - pollen replacing honey per eg.

The main difference on stores is the amount of brooding taking place - larvae are very likely consuming more than the nectar foraged at this time and the brood nest temperature has to be maintained. And old bees are dying off, to be replaced by new winter bees.

One plus might be that the winter bees have a shorter time to survive from now until spring expansion starts.... Of course, weather patterns might make a joke of the best plans, come the springtime.

The only fixed plan I have is to wait and see if they need extra feeding in the winter. That will depend on stores levels when they finally cluster and settle down for the winter.

RAB

i don't really advise waiting in this job if in doubt feed
if you ram them up with feed till they are as heavy as lead when you lift with two hands( not one) you wont go far wrong
simples

 

[Erichalfbee]

What is of most concern to me is that, if the queen stopped or diminished her laying when the Apiguard was on (4 weeks from mid Aug), there may not be enough longlived and fit young bees to carry them through the winter

Happened to me last winter.
I knew she had stopped laying but as it was my strongest most productive colony I left it alone and crossed my fingers.
Next spring there were quite a few dead bees on the floor and on one of the frames a small knot of dead bees with a dead queen in the middle

 

[TryingToLetThemBee]

Happened to me last winter.
I knew she had stopped laying but as it was my strongest most productive colony I left it alone and crossed my fingers.
Next spring there were quite a few dead bees on the floor and on one of the frames a small knot of dead bees with a dead queen in the middle

I'm not taking the proverbial out of anyone when I say that my goodness there's a lot to worry about in my first winter.

 

[drstitson]

Bees are living organisms that require energy to live.
If they do not forage colony energy input = 0. but still need X calories/joules for survival so YES stores will be consumed.

the idea is to ensure that the colony has enough stores to ensure provision of enough energy for the whole winter period.

That's why a full brood and a half/14x12/LS jumbo/dadant FULL of stores is the safest way to enter late autumn.

if you only have 10+kg of stores now then a decent fondant supplement will be needed UNLESS a further decent top up of syrup given.

If it were me? i'd whack on a whole block of fondant in an eke and shut up for winter.

 

[user 6228]

....

if you only have 10+kg of stores now then a decent fondant supplement will be needed UNLESS a further decent top up of syrup given.
...

Insert here my usual comment...

 

[Cazza]

Already fed 24lbs + sugar per hive ....and another 24 lbs to go I trust?

You can stick on an extra 24lbs if you want to. I have never fed more than that as ivy fills up my hives perfectly well until l use Neopoll late Feb. Must be my supereconomic AMM bees.
Cazza

 

[drstitson]

"there may not be enough longlived and fit young bees to carry them through the winter"

without brood rearing your summer bees haven't been aged so will happily survive.

 

[mbc]

Insert here my usual comment...

very good !

 

[Arfermo]

"there may not be enough longlived and fit young bees to carry them through the winter"

without brood rearing your summer bees haven't been aged so will happily survive.

They age from the exertion of foraging of which there has been and still is an abundance QED.

 

[oliver90owner]

i don't really advise waiting in this job if in doubt feed*

If you are posting after quoting me, at least read it properly or comment on what I actually wrote. I said "the only fixed plan".

The rest are fluid as per usual. A more than subtle difference to your poor interpretation.