Drone rearing?

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How early in the year do others start drone rearing. I'm guessing it's a case of selecting the colonies and putting a frame of drawn drone comb in the middle.

Its a bit more than just choosing any colony and make it a drone rearing colony. It has to be "ripe" for reproduction. There is no use giving drone comb to a nucleus or a colony with a very young queen. It isn't ready to reproduce yet.
Its best to choose a colony with lots of sealed brood & plenty of pollen (i.e. exactly the same conditions you'd use for queen rearing). Then, you can dequeen it or give it a queen cell so there are no drones being produced. Then transfer frames of sealed drone comb from your drone mother into the drone colony alongside the brood. They will then accept the drones as their own.
Ideally, place the drone rearer above a queen excluder so you can mark the drones you are interested in with a queen marking pen/paint as soon as they emerge so you can be sure you are using the correct drones.
 
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Drone rearing is not needed. Bees do it themselves.
Lack of drones is never a reason of poor mating.
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How early in the year do others start drone rearing. I'm guessing it's a case of selecting the colonies and putting a frame of drawn drone comb in the middle.

When you have 9 hives, it is not possible to breed own strain, or get certain queens mated freely with some certain hive. British sky is full is mongrell genes.
 
How early in the year do others start drone rearing.-

About 5 or 6 weeks before you need them. Hopefully, you would have your queens ready for mating a couple of weeks before other colonies in the area raise drones. Then cross fingers that the weather is good!

That is assuming you are not going the II method. In the case of II, it would not matter a jot when you started!
 
When you have 9 hives, it is not possible to breed own strain, or get certain queens mated freely with some certain hive. British sky is full is mongrell genes.

Hawklord is only a few bee miles from one of my apiary sites, so may get some decent buckfast genes from my drones :). Although the competition is fierce in the area with beekeepers at Nunnington, Helmsley and several more in Pickering. Isolated mating is not a feasable option.
I thought I might have found a reasonable isolated site at the head of one of the "forgotten" dales, then I found one of the local farmers keeps bees and practices let alone beekeeping as they are too fierce to handle! That was that idea scuppered.
 
I thought I might have found a reasonable isolated site at the head of one of the "forgotten" dales, then I found one of the local farmers keeps bees and practices let alone beekeeping as they are too fierce to handle! That was that idea scuppered.

I'm sorry to hear that Thymallus. I think II is really the only 100% certain way of breeding bees in this country
 
I'm sorry to hear that Thymallus. I think II is really the only 100% certain way of breeding bees in this country

It was a long shot....but pretty isolated area, miles from anywhere. Next step is to get introduced to farmer with bees and see if he wants to try some of mine.... It would only be of use until late July anyway when people people bring their bees to the heather. And there may be another one or two keepers tucked away that we don't know about. Despite it's relative isolation we counted nearly 100 hives in 1 site about 5 miles away from ours, brought in specifically for the heather! Far too dense in bees numbers in one area to do much good me thinks. Suspect it was a crop by numbers rather than more honey for less hives.
 
Its a bit more than just choosing any colony and make it a drone rearing colony. It has to be "ripe" for reproduction. There is no use giving drone comb to a nucleus or a colony with a very young queen. It isn't ready to reproduce yet.
Its best to choose a colony with lots of sealed brood & plenty of pollen (i.e. exactly the same conditions you'd use for queen rearing). Then, you can dequeen it or give it a queen cell so there are no drones being produced. Then transfer frames of sealed drone comb from your drone mother into the drone colony alongside the brood. They will then accept the drones as their own.
Ideally, place the drone rearer above a queen excluder so you can mark the drones you are interested in with a queen marking pen/paint as soon as they emerge so you can be sure you are using the correct drones.

What's the reason for transferring the drone brood?
 
What's the reason for transferring the drone brood?

One colony can only support a certain number of drones, but, you can transfer combs on drone brood from a drone mothers colony into other colonies (just as you would do in queen raising) so they can be nursed by the workers. This allows you to get a lot more mature drones from a queen. An alternate solution is to raise lots of daughter queens from a tested queen which will each raise drones

You can read more about this in "Breeding Techniques and Selection for Breeding of the Honeybee" by Friedrich Ruttner pp 90-92
 
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And question, how early.

If is not wise to rear Queen "early". They just have difficulties to get good mating weathers, 3 days sun, calm and 20C temp.

Nowadays I rear my queens when hives start to swarm, I change larvae in queen cells. Quality of queens will be best without any hokkus pokkus.
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Will the colonies who receive the drone brood think they have raised enough drones and therefore not raise any from their own queen?

Essentially, yes. However, in periods of dearth, colonies sacrifice older drones and favour younger drones (an investment in the future at the expense of the present). So, it is important to maintain the colony just like a cell raising colony with plenty of nectar, pollen and young bees.
 
Hawklord is only a few bee miles from one of my apiary sites, so may get some decent buckfast genes from my drones :). .

That will not happen. Queens mate under 1 km distance when it has been measured the time what queens use in mating flights.

If you have good genes, why don't you donate those queens directly as a form of reared virgins.

Another way is that you give to Hawklord piece of comb, the she can move 15 larvae into swarm cells.

Or Hawklord bye package of good genes as a form of mated queens.


When I wanted to shake off swarming genes from my hives, I boughg laying queens. So swarm gene drones cannot mix the soup any more.
 
How early in the year do others start drone rearing. I'm guessing it's a case of selecting the colonies and putting a frame of drawn drone comb in the middle.

You will have to disregard some of the nonsense promulgated by some on queen rearing!

Drone rearing for open mating in an isolated apiary takes place years before with queen selection.

Some it seems are still under the misconception that a that a good last seasons queen will automatically produce good drones.... a couple of frames of drone brood supplied from someone who thinks he has decent whatever bees does not cut the mustard!

Possibly... however the beebreeder needs to look much further back to the parents, grand parents and even great grandparents to select for the qualities required.. this requires good record keeping ( as B+ does with his Carnolians and Hivemaker does with his line of hybrids)


Once your specific colonies for drone propogation have been selected in the previous season... beef them up to double brood... feed and treat let them keep their own stores and do not over inspect!
At the beginning of the season replace the used up stores frames with ready drawn DRONE foundation placing next to the worker brood already being nurtured.

Do the same with any other colonies in you isolated apiary... but use undrawn foundation... this is valuable once drawn out.

Cull drones laid up throughout the season from the support colonies ( ideally you would only have your selected colonies in the isolated mating apiary)

Method has worked well for me in my deep dark valley where the little birds do change their voices! ( Folk song from Bob Maynard Copthorne Sussex.. Banks of Sweet Primeroses!)

Yeghes da
 
That will not happen. Queens mate under 1 km distance when it has been measured the time what queens use in mating flights.

According to Gudran Koeniger, drones stay quite close to the apiary so they can stay aloft for longer while queens fly to distant drone congregational areas so inbreeding is minimised (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cI26DLS2CyM)
 
Think about how far drones travel.

Queens go to the nearest drone swarm.
I can here how my drones collect themselves 50 yeards from my hives and keep quite a sound in air.
Q
I know those travelling men. I have mating nucs on outer yards and I do not know hives there. But I get too much Carniolan semen from those outer places.

One explanation is that if a wild colony has 20% drone brood out of their combs, and I cut most of my drone brood away, wild drones have more troops in air.

I think that wild colonies live out there in abandoned farm houses.



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According to Gudran Koeniger, drones stay quite close to the apiary so they can stay aloft for longer while queens fly to distant drone congregational areas so inbreeding is minimised (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cI26DLS2CyM)

I have thought so too. But there is a research, which has measured, how many mating flights queens did, how long they were outside and how many days queens needed to be full mated. They followed with video the queen traffic.

According the results queen were so short times outside, that when they fly 25 km/h, they cannot go very far from hives.


But what we can do, is to hope wanted things. No one can get hope away from us.

Facts make beekeepers..., not sick, but at least angry.

That research did not support idea that inbreeding is minimized. It is old legend however from times when it was not known that the queen mates with 16 drones. There was a time when fastest drone won the competition flight.


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According to Gudran Koeniger, drones stay quite close to the apiary

... and can often be found in hives 12 miles or more away from the hive they came from.

If the colonies were in complete isolation i would agree, other than that they can travel great distances.
 
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