Do bees uncap stores and move it upwards in spring?

[user 20297]

This subject was touched on elsewhere and I'm not sure about the answers given.

In a situation where they are becoming "honeybound" in a single broodbox and you expand the hive by giving an emprty box above a QX, I thought that bees would fill the new box only with freshly colllected nectar and pollen. Adding above the super obviously does nothing to reduce congestion of the broodnest.

If bees do uncap surplus winter stores and move them upwards, that obviously creates a potential problem of contaminated honey, but also means that the risk of them running out of space should be less of a concern than it seems to be for some people.

What do people think?

 

[rolande]

Moving honey which is impeding the immediate expansion of the brood area isn't necessarily the same as moving everything up above an excluder nor will it, in itself, free up so much space that there's no longer a possibility of congestion but there will be stores, possibly containing sugar and in some apiaries thymol above the excluder.

Of course, depending on location those moved stores may still be consumed before the spring (or June) is out of the way.

 

[ericbeaumont]

If bees do uncap surplus winter stores and move them upwards

More effective if the beekeeper uncaps. Use the flat of a hive tool or scratch with an uncapping fork.

 

[user 20297]

I suppose that my real interest is to know if bees would uncap "honey" and restore it above an excluder without any persuasive tactics by the beekeeper. It is not that I want them to do that, in fact, just the opposite.

 

[Murox]

They might, then again they might not, depends if they follow they rule - food above brood

 

[Macbear]

I made a bad mistake in keeping a super above the brood box over winter. I also left the QE on! Despite my folly my hives have overwintered well. The supers which had frames of uncapped honey are capped. Yes, there were other wet supers which had been spun, but those were removed within a couple of days of harvesting as the bees had cleaned up well.
Supplementary winter feeding has been unnecessary.
It hasn't been warm enough to look at the brood, but pollen going in hasn't been stored in the super. I'm now wondering if I face the prospect of either doing a mini-harvest in May or storing those supers once I put empty supers on. I want to leave stores until the June gap - but last year there seemed plenty of forage in my neck of the woods.
As I'm attending an "Improvers" course members will understand my desire to learn form my mistakes, so advice would be welcomed.

 

[ericbeaumont]

The supers which had frames of uncapped honey are capped

By now they may have set, partially or completely, esp. if ivy.

Wait for a May dearth or drought, put above a CB and they'll clean it out. Alternative is Roger Patterson's method, which I've used successfully.

http://www.dave-cushman.net/bee/clearcombstores.html

 

[magor]

I suppose that my real interest is to know if bees would uncap "honey" and restore it above an excluder without any persuasive tactics by the beekeeper. It is not that I want them to do that, in fact, just the opposite.

i do no believe that bees move stores but only consume em, bees are economical energy insects

 

[user 20297]

i do no believe that bees move stores but only consume em, bees are economical energy insects

Thank-you. That is what I also think, but there seem to be some mixed messages on the forum.
There is a contradiction when most people say you should be ready to remove honey frames from brood-boxes after the winter to avoid congested space....good advice; but some people say that you also need to be careful and watch that the bees don't put any sugar stores into the honey-supers that are placed in spring.
I agree that it seems unlikely that bees would double-handle their carefully packed stores.

 

[Ian123]

Once honey/stores are capped I don’t think it’s moved around often, I’m not saying they don’t move some but I’ve always found them reluctant. It’s only when it’s consumed or the beekeeper bruises the cappings you normally see space appear. Even when you bruise cappings and have an additional box on you don’t see it mysteriously filled. So imo there’s minimal movement normally. Often the cause of early swarms is brood nest congestion even when people give space above, a mistake often made by beginners.

 

[fian]

Analysis parameters.
What breeding box are we talking about, 8.5" or 12"? And which box do we place above 5.5"? How blocked is the nest at 50%?
The simplest thing is to remove boxes full of honey and arrange a base without stretching on the sides of the nest (B by H).
Schemes HHBCCCCBHH.
HBHBCCBHBH.
Foundation.
1. To produce and stretch wax, bees need energy, which means more honey consumption.
2. As soon as she starts to stretch the queen occupies the space with posture. This brood breaks in three days so the consumption of honey is relieved from the sows to the nurses (food for larvae).
3. As the bees consume honey, the empty cell fills with pollen.

 

[user 20297]

Once honey/stores are capped I don’t think it’s moved around often, I’m not saying they don’t move some but I’ve always found them reluctant. It’s only when it’s consumed or the beekeeper bruises the cappings you normally see space appear. Even when you bruise cappings and have an additional box on you don’t see it mysteriously filled. So imo there’s minimal movement normally. Often the cause of early swarms is brood nest congestion even when people give space above, a mistake often made by beginners.

Thank you Ian...my question is thoroughly answered.