Dead bees

[starcana]

Just been to do my first inspection - just had a feeling what I would find and so upset. All my bees, a good strong colony in the autumn, dead! I'd had them from a swarm in summer 2010. For the first time this autumn I only fed them the frames to clean after taking the honey then two lots of fondant one in early autumn and one just after Christmas but no liquid feed. I'm guessing I must have starved them and feel so bad about it. Some dead bees on the frame but loads on the floor. I'll take some pix when I go to clean the hive later in the week. Haven't got the heart to do it today. Lost a hive last winter, but that was a very weak colony. So as I only have two hives I'm back to square one. Hey ho.

 

[Beeforest]

How much honey did you take from them?

 

[gavin]

Sorry to hear that. How were you treating for Varroa?

 

[REDWOOD]

Sorry that you lost your bees, a strong colony need more than the scrapings to feed them through the winter they need about 2-3 gallons of 2:1 feed and in low temps we have had then give them fondant. Your not the first or the last to loose bees so Keep with this forum you will learn a lot from the experienced beekeepers here, I learn something new every time I log on
Life is one big learning curve

 

[piggy1]

i've also lost one , nothing in the hive at all ?? other colony looking good pleasingly

 

[Luminos]

Commiserations, starcana - and piggy1.
Don't give up. Learn from it, move on, get more bees. That was the advice given to me and I'm looking forward to getting more bees from very kind forum member in a couple of months.

 

[starcana]

Thanks for the sympathy folks. Beeforest, I took 19 lbs of honey very proudly in August and did give them two large helpings of fondant, but obviously not enough. I treated twice with apiguard. Any idea why some were dead on the frames and most (lots) on the floor?.

 

[starcana]

Also would love to hear from anyone who's got any bees for me in Cornwall, otherwise will have to wait for some swarms - cant afford to buy nuclei I for my two empty (only) hives

 

[Baggyone]

In the frames trying to suck out the last bits of stores and the dead on the floor simply those that starved without having tried to eat out the frames.

At least you have another hive, but remember to feed your bees fully next autumn.

Baggy

 

[Beeforest]

Thanks for the sympathy folks. Beeforest, I took 19 lbs of honey very proudly in August and did give them two large helpings of fondant, but obviously not enough. I treated twice with apiguard. Any idea why some were dead on the frames and most (lots) on the floor?.

Yes,. Sorry to hear of your loss. I'm a new beekeeper so unable to give you advice. I was more interested to learn by how much honey you took. I collected two swarms last year, fed in autumn and fondant in the last month, but I've yet to take any honey!

Have you thought about setting up a bait hive, there's some good advice on this on David Heaf's site?

 

[oliver90owner]

then two lots of fondant one in early autumn and one just after Christmas

Not sure what a 'lot' is and no idea of where you might be located. It could make a great deal of difference.

20kg of stores should, for most, be adequate winter provisions. What you took off is totally irelevant; what you left on is much more important. Main reason for finding dead bees on the floor is gravity.

Sorry, but beekeeping is take and give - you take the honey and you give them enough stores in exchange, along with appropriate treatments to keep them healthy. Two apiguard treatments seem to indicate a colony management problem. They need adequate looking after as dead colonies do not collect a honey crop -as you are painfully aware, now.

You already seem to be aware that you starved them (you said 'obviously not enough(fondant). Get more bees if you have learned from it. 20kg 'average' - might be more, might be a little less.

 

[starcana]

Interested to know why 2apiguards indicates management problem - I thought that was pretty standard - one and then one a fortnight or so later? I'm in Cornwall and they seemed to have a lot of stores around October/Novemer but I gave fondant anyway thinking it couldn't do any harm to have extra - then again all fine after Xmas. But I was away for three weeks in our only really cold spell. And I now only have two empty hives - not one as one poster thought. So cross at myself cos did a course in October/Novemer (6 Saturdays) and was obviously doing better before the course ( not really, i know I learned a lot). Thanks for all responses.

 

[richardbees]

Two apiguard treatments seem to indicate a colony management problem.

Sorry Oliver but that's the recommended dose....one tray then a second tray a fortnight later.........making a total of 2 (two)

Maybe you misunderstood starcana's post?

 

[oliver90owner]

Interested to know why 2apiguards indicates management problem - I thought that was pretty standard - one and then one a fortnight or so later?

one and then one a fortnight or so later That is one treatment.

You may or may not have read the instructions for use on the apiguard pack. It says, and I quote:

'Two applications of 1 tray of 50g APIGUARD at a two week interval. Maximumum of two treatments per year.' (my underlining)

You said, and I quote again:

'I treated twice with apiguard.'

Please tell me how else I am supposed to read it, other than as I understood it initially. Two treatments, to me, means two treatments.

Perhaps you need to learn to estimate the stores by hefting, or even by weighing the hive.

 

[starcana]

Sorry, yes perhaps it was misleading. Anyway, if I manage to get more bees I won't make the mistake of under feeding again!

 

[Moggs]

Sorry to hear of your loss. Why no syrup feed? Too late?

 

[Hombre]

Also would love to hear from anyone who's got any bees for me in Cornwall, otherwise will have to wait for some swarms - cant afford to buy nuclei I for my two empty (only) hives

Don't forget that you will need to think about affording around 30kg of sugar around the end of August to get two colonies through the winter. Bees are a bit like children. Having taken them on the responsibility of feeding is something is no longer optional. Good job it wasn't a couple of dogs!

 

[oliver90owner]

Sorry Oliver but that's the recommended dose....one tray then a second tray a fortnight later.........making a total of 2 (two)

Sorry, but how can we expect new beeks to be able to tead or understand treatment instructions when there regular beekis out there who don't know the difference between 'applications per treatment' and 'treatments'.

So, YES, it is tyhe recommended dose for ONE TREATMENT.

Please get your facts right before jumping in. I'm glad you are not my doctor or pharmacist!

 

[gavin]

That's just plain ridiculous. Treatment can be a single treatment or a course of treatment.

Oxford English Dictionary:

Treatment.
2. medical care given to a patient for an illness or injury, eg I’m receiving treatment for an injured shoulder

It is a generic term not necessarily one for a single event. Now go and write 50 lines:

'I must stop being brusque on the beekeeping forum'.

 

[Chris Luck]

Whilst I fully understand there can be a requirement to feed either syrup or paste there is certainly no definite rule about this and I find some of the figures quoted in this and other threads extraordinary.

As an example, (and there are hundreds),..

Don't forget that you will need to think about affording around 30kg of sugar around the end of August to get two colonies through the winter. Bees are a bit like children. Having taken them on the responsibility of feeding is something is no longer optional. Good job it wasn't a couple of dogs!

There are many years when I have no requirement to feed at all OR perhaps a small quantity, (perhaps 3 or 4 litres each in autumn), selectively to some colonies. To me it's a matter of judgement and hefting and I accept that this is not a skill that can be learnt from a book or a forum, but then what skills can be?

Good luck in the future.
Chris