Dead Bee-Hives over the winter with almost no corpses.

[pargyle]

And on that note, I can happily report that the wild bee colony in the oak tree at my Ty Uchaf apiary have survived yet another winter (so far) this is the fifth spring that I've been at that apiary and its the same colony, and they were there before I moved in.

Yes... I think theres more to why some colonies survive than we know ...even when varroa is present and others just seem incapable. I'm not an immense believer in VSH bèes .. they certainly seem to exist but in certain circumstances.. take them out of those circumstances and they don't seem to fare as well. I've got this notion that theres a combination of climate, forage, environment, bee characteristics and how we look after them that allows some colonies the means to cope with varroa and somehow the particular conditions in your oak tree colony must provide them with this ability. Unless you are sneaking a quick dose of OA in to them on a dark night in September ! People will try and tell you its not the same colony but I've seen enough untreated colonies to know that there is something we don't know and if we could bottle it .. theres an answer.. in the meantime OA appears the logical solution for most people.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

People will try and tell you its not the same colony .

They could try, but they would struggle to scrape any data to bolster their feeble argument, the same as the chapel colony which, until it died of starvation after that horrible false spring and second winter of 2011, or 12, or whenever it was. This colony gets regular status checks throughout the winter, so, unless somewhere in the Aman valley there is a colony of bees that swarms annually on Christmas day(which would then pose the question, how are they surviving?) this is definitely the same colony that was first brought to my attention on a spring day way back five or six years ago (I can't exactly recall the date)

 

[Ueanuwug]

So I have been on the hives today and made pictures out of two.

After further inspection things I've noticed:
- The picture the user Erichalfbee send. I have noticed some crumbs in the combs, but not white. More yellowish which looks more like wax leftovers to me. Though there are some white in that specific area I photographed.
- Very little pollen in ALL of them. Note that last years summer was horrible in my region. Very little sunshine, quite cold for a summer and a drought.
- Still quite a bit of honey leftover. Too much. So they must have passed away before and during the start of winter and not throughout it.


Pictures from first hive:

 

[Ueanuwug]

Pictures from second hive:

 

[Boston Bees]

So I have been on the hives today and made pictures out of two.

After further inspection things I've noticed:
- The picture the user Erichalfbee send. I have noticed some crumbs in the combs, but not white. More yellowish which looks more like wax leftovers to me. Though there are some white in that specific area I photographed.
- Very little pollen in ALL of them. Note that last years summer was horrible in my region. Very little sunshine, quite cold for a summer and a drought.
- Still quite a bit of honey leftover. Too much. So they must have passed away before and during the start of winter and not throughout it.


Pictures from first hive:

Thanks for being kind enough to share these pics - they are very useful for us all to see.

A see a few abdomens that look suspiciously glossy black, suggesting chronic bee paralysis virus (introduced by varroa)?

Perforated brood capping, and bees struggling to emerge, also suggests parasitic mite syndrome (though something else could also cause this)

This, combined with the presence of food, and previous information regarding the mite treatment regime (removal of open brood frames, which isn't where varroa live, and sugar dusting, which harms brood and does little for varroa), makes me think this is just a major varroa issue.

Some of the larvae are in a terrible state, but I can't see clear foulbrood evidence - but I may be missing something obvious ....

 

[Erichalfbee]

CBPV is not varroa vectored

 

[Boston Bees]

CBPV is not varroa vectored

I think your statement is somewhat too definitive, but I admit that it is not solely vectored by varroa, or indeed even mainly vectored by varroa. But I think there is no proof that varroa don't spread it.

 

[Erichalfbee]

I think your statement is somewhat too definitive, but I admit that it is not solely vectored by varroa, or indeed even mainly vectored by varroa. But I think there is no proof that varroa don't spread it.

This is worth reading
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41467-020-15919-0

 

[BugsInABox]

I think your statement is somewhat too definitive, but I admit that it is not solely vectored by varroa, or indeed even mainly vectored by varroa. But I think there is no proof that varroa don't spread it.

There can never be proof of a negative.

 

[Boston Bees]

I negative can never be proven.

Assuming you mean "A negative can never be proven", of course it can. I can prove that there is no African elephant in my living room very easily.

But back to the matter in hand, the fact that CBPV has been found in varroa suggests that it is perfectly possible that varroa can spread it.

But I fully admit it would not be the main method of spreading it within a hive or between hives.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Of course it can. I can prove that there is no adult elephant in my living room very easily.

It could be a small elephant - hiding behind the curtains

 

[Boston Bees]

It could be a small elephant - hiding behind the curtains

I thought about that, hence the "adult"

Also, no curtains

Try again

 

[user 20297]

I can prove that there is no African elephant in my living room very easily.

...but you can't prove that there never will be....

 

[madasafish]

Assuming you mean "A negative can never be proven", of course it can. I can prove that there is no African elephant in my living room very easily.

But back to the matter in hand, the fact that CBPV has been found in varroa suggests that it is perfectly possible that varroa can spread it.

But I fully admit it would not be the main method of spreading it within a hive or between hives.

State your theory and then tell people it's right unless they prove otherwise is junk science.
Real science is stating your theory and then proving it.

Which basically means you can ignore 99% of politicians' words.

 

[BugsInABox]

Of course it can. I can prove that there is no adult elephant in my living room very easily.

Nope you can't prove even that?
All you can actually say is, 'so far I have failed to discover that there is an adult elephant in my living room'; you might even extend that to 'as a result I am increasingly confident there is probably no elephant in my living room' (this is analogous to Dani's comments re CBPV and varroa) but you definitely cannot prove it.
Not least because we don't know what we don't know it is never possible to logically defend a premise which claims to prove a negative. Hence, there is no proof that varroa don't spread it, is a junk science statement - there never can be such proof.

 

[Boston Bees]

Is anyone else going to respond to the poor guy's photos?

 

[Erichalfbee]

Is anyone else going to respond to the poor guy's photos?

I can’t see varroa guanine to any extent. I agree with you that the exposed pupae look in a dreadful state. Difficult to tell as a lot are mouldy. I’m not sure but are there dark scales in some of those cells ? I would be opening up some of those capped brood cells.

 

[Ueanuwug]

I would be opening up some of those capped brood cells.

I would appreciate, if you are a bit more precise in what you want/need to see so I can provide it. In the end I want to figure this out so I can eventually avoid these mistakes in the future.

 

[E&MBees]

I can’t see varroa guanine to any extent. I agree with you that the exposed pupae look in a dreadful state. Difficult to tell as a lot are mouldy. I’m not sure but are there dark scales in some of those cells ? I would be opening up some of those capped brood cells.

Dani, would you be able to label up the frame that you were looking at please, so that I can spot what you looked at? Thanks, Emily

 

[The Poot]

Nope you can't prove even that?
All you can actually say is, 'so far I have failed to discover that there is an adult elephant in my living room'; you might even extend that to 'as a result I am increasingly confident there is probably no elephant in my living room' (this is analogous to Dani's comments re CBPV and varroa) but you definitely cannot prove it.
Not least because we don't know what we don't know it is never possible to logically defend a premise which claims to prove a negative. Hence there is no proof that varroa don't spread it, is a junk science statement - there never can be such proof.

A bit too Donald Runsfeld for my liking......