combining mini-nuc with 5 frame nuc

[dlawr42103]

I have a tiny 3 frame mini poly nuc which I recently acquired purely out of curiosity. On finding a QC a few weeks ago I popped it in the mini nuc with a cup full of bees and left them to get on with things, kind of assuming nothing much would happen.

7 days ago I had a peek inside and was amazed and delighted at actually witnessing a queen emerging! A truly wonderful thing to behold. Beautiful looking, with an almost yellow abdomen.

I had read that absconding is quite common with these little nucs, so still wasn't expecting much.

Today I had another look as I have been watching pollen being taken in. The little frames are drawn out and on one of them there is about 15 - 20 eggs! lovely.. presumably she just started today.

Now Im not quite sure what to do with her as they will obviously outgrow this quick.

I have a number of other hives and nuc's available, but most are all doing well and in no need of a new queen.

I do have one 5 frame poly nuc that seems to have lost its queen, so I would like to move her into there. My gut instinct is to pop her in a cage and introduce her that way... or ... would I be better to try and do some kind of newspaper unite (difficult with such a tiny nuc)... or.. maybe combine everything together in a new full size hive? ... what would you do?

 

[oliver90owner]

First off I would make sure the colony is queenless. Most are not.

I would be checking your dates. They do not seem to be quite as expected. Seven days from emergence to laying is very short indeed.

 

[Bosleeu]

Good for you! That is indeed very quick. They do seem to mate quicker in mininucs.

I would suggest leaving her for a week or two longer, then introduce her with a cage or with a bit of smoke. It will be a lot of hassle to figure out a way to unite them. Maybe use a test frame to confirm the Nuc is queenless. If they make a few nice cells you could then give one of them to the mating Nuc before you destroy the others to make yet another queen. Yes she will be an emergency queen but you have the mating Nuc set up now and a spare queen could be handy at any time.

 

[Midland Beek]

I think the idea is to just introduce the queen. Before you do so you could put the mini nuc on the hive roof for a few days, and then after removing queen spray bees with sugar water and bang them out over top bars.

 

[Tom Bick]

If your nucs are apideas you could slide the floor back and then combine over a feed hole with the paper method. I did this a couple of years ago and worked just fine one hive the queen made her way down into the hive but on the other she was still in the apidea a few days later so I simply placed the frame on top of the big frames and she walked down between the frames. I must say that they were both very full apideas and the queens had been laying for some time.

Also as I did not want to waste the brood in the apideas I fixed the three frames to a top bar and placed that in the hive, the three frames fit onto a top bar providing you overlap the plastic lugs. The bees filled in the gaps with comb but the frames easily cut out the following spring before filled with brood once more.

 

[Heather]

Sorry to barge your posts but problem with similar theme.

I have an apidea with queen going well, and 5 little frames bursting with stores. I put a Nuc sized plastic floor with apidea sized hole in and placed on top of exposed apidea. Put a Nuc box over with 2 drawn brood frame ( rest dummied off). A syrup feed above this. They will NOT go up. Have dribbles syrup down. Only thing left is to put a frame of spun off honey in as well to tempt them but that leaves a bit of a gap.
Any advice??

Tom, just seen your idea... maybe wire those apidea brood frames into a frame in brood box. Just wanted to keep those bees undisturbed as pos and let them do it naturally, but they ARE DEFYING ME, damn them!

 

[Bosleeu]

I take it you mean instead of uniting you are trying to move a mini-colony into a Nuc box and build them up into a full Nuc?

Interesting. And brave.

Perhaps make windows in the brood frame comb just under the top bar the same size as your mini-frames and wire them in? You can retrieve your mini-frames once the mission has been accomplished.

That will make it easy for them to expand onto the brood frame comb.

Would suggest trying to give them top bee space if you don't have it already above the brood frames to make it easy for them to keep in touch. Otherwise they will have quite a large area of empty comb to walk across to get to the other side. Can't see the queen doing that until she has quite a lot more bees.

If that sounds too fiddly the idea mentioned before of just wiring them to a top bar sounds good.

Either way once the move has been done I suspect some emerging brood from somewhere would really help with the buildup.

 

[Cazza]

If your nucs are apideas you could slide the floor back and then combine over a feed hole with the paper method. I did this a couple of years ago and worked just fine one hive the queen made her way down into the hive but on the other she was still in the apidea a few days later so I simply placed the frame on top of the big frames and she walked down between the frames. I must say that they were both very full apideas and the queens had been laying for some time.

Also as I did not want to waste the brood in the apideas I fixed the three frames to a top bar and placed that in the hive, the three frames fit onto a top bar providing you overlap the plastic lugs. The bees filled in the gaps with comb but the frames easily cut out the following spring before filled with brood once more.

Snap! I have done this too.
Cazza

 

[Hawklord]

If your nucs are apideas you could slide the floor back and then combine over a feed hole with the paper method. I did this a couple of years ago and worked just fine one hive the queen made her way down into the hive but on the other she was still in the apidea a few days later so I simply placed the frame on top of the big frames and she walked down between the frames. I must say that they were both very full apideas and the queens had been laying for some time.

Also as I did not want to waste the brood in the apideas I fixed the three frames to a top bar and placed that in the hive, the three frames fit onto a top bar providing you overlap the plastic lugs. The bees filled in the gaps with comb but the frames easily cut out the following spring before filled with brood once more.

Did you put the Apidea inside a super.

 

[dlawr42103]

wiring frames together...

Tom, Cazza & Bossleeu...

Some time back I wired in three small frames into a full brood frame, but it was quite a faff.. I used plastic cable ties, which were relatively quick to use.. but with bees all over the frames and everything wobbly to start off with I really needed another pair of hands!..... Is there a known easier way of doing this?

Tom - for my problem, I think I shall be trying your suggestion for uniting, sounds fun!

 

[Tom Bick]

Snap! I have done this too.
Cazza

I don't think we will be alone

Did you put the Apidea inside a super.

I think from memory I used a bb but a super would do the same.

Tom, Cazza & Bossleeu...

Some time back I wired in three small frames into a full brood frame, but it was quite a faff.. I used plastic cable ties, which were relatively quick to use.. but with bees all over the frames and everything wobbly to start off with I really needed another pair of hands!..... Is there a known easier way of doing this?

Tom - for my problem, I think I shall be trying your suggestion for uniting, sounds fun!

I used pieces of wire and it was fiddly and only used a top bar, don't know if that would make it easier, I do remember the small frames were rather wobbly at first but the bees soon sorted that.

 

[Bosleeu]

Tom, Cazza & Bossleeu...

Some time back I wired in three small frames into a full brood frame, but it was quite a faff.. I used plastic cable ties, which were relatively quick to use.. but with bees all over the frames and everything wobbly to start off with I really needed another pair of hands!..... Is there a known easier way of doing this?

Smallish elastic bands are easier to apply and should hold them in place temporarily whilst you apply a cabletie or wire. Still a bit fiddly though