Cell starters: Q+ or Q-??

[Poly Hive]

In the past I have used numerous young bees shook into a nuc box for the starter and this has at times worked well, my best being 32 from 36 accepted.

I was reading the NBU Q+ system last night and am now pondering. I no longer have numerous stocks to take nurse bees from so the Q+ system seems the better option.

Any thoughts?

PH

 

[For want of a better word]

In the past I have used numerous young bees shook into a nuc box for the starter and this has at times worked well, my best being 32 from 36 accepted.

I was reading the NBU Q+ system last night and am now pondering. I no longer have numerous stocks to take nurse bees from so the Q+ system seems the better option.

Any thoughts?

PH

I have tried both... and a q- nuc box crammed with bees has given the best results as a starter.
Teaching granny to suck eggs I know,,, but a q+ finisher with a feeder on is a must!

Chons da

 

[maddydog]

Tried both. This year I'm using converted Paynes 14x12 nuc (so 8 frames) with a top feeder. Made hopelessly queenless with lots of emerging brood & young bees.

These have worked well this year but I only put a maximum of 18 grafts per colony. The QCs stay in until day 10 and are then moved to the incubator. Added bonus is I can move the starter to where I want to graft from.

 

[drex]

I do not have much experience of queen rearing but for last three years have used a Cloake board. Makes sense to me, and I only need a dozen or so queens, and has been brilliant so far.

 

[Poly Hive]

Hmm well I tried the CB last year in pretty good weather and frankly was underwhelmed by the results and the box was bloody strong.

PH

 

[mbc]

Q- for me every time.

 

[Eyeman]

Q+ system can take a round or 2 to get up to speed but can then work well.
I now use a Q- starter which uses the brood from 'congested colonies'. I only have 41 mini nucs so need to leave a 3-4 week gap between rounds of grafting so I don't mind setting up a fresh starter each round. The Q- has been more consistent than the Q+ system.

 

[mbc]

Hmm well I tried the CB last year in pretty good weather and frankly was underwhelmed by the results and the box was bloody strong.

PH

Think of it as a split board/excluder with an entrance, shake the young bees from the nest bellow into the top box and leave the board in until the cells are sealed then the board just becomes a time saving device for 're uniting the boxes and works well.

 

[Ian123]

Hi poly with those results you have got you are doing fine. 1 method I use is to designate 1 colony and remove queen and a small nuc, you can if you wish do the method as an artificial swarm leaving old queen on original site. The cell starter/raiser is broken down to a single brood with solid 11/12 frames of sealed brood, I will pinch sealed brood or juggle frames of eggs with other hives. Don’t worry about food I will feed constantly once set up and the bees will back fill any emerging/vacant cells. 3-4 days later I give a vape to reduce back ground varroa and add grafts the next day. By this time they have no option but your grafts, you have a box full of bees even bearding at the front and by the time cells are capped a box full of feed frames and bees for nucs or another round of cells. I would say that I find just removing the queen and a couple of frames better, the fact you retain the old flying bees is irrelevant as you are also ensuring masses of young nurse bees with donor sealed brood and that already in the colony.