capped q cell destroyed

[Cuckmere couple]

and refers to post in beginners section where ive today found a single capped q cell...no other charged q cells...in a buckfast colony bought this year....larvae was alive and healthy...destroyed it and left q (seen) in colony

what would have happened had this one hatched?

 

[Brigsy]

Supercedure probably.

 

[beeno]

Probably not, too late in the year as there are not enough drones around and the ones that are would probably not be in good enough condition to mate. I would have done exactly the same. Make sure that the queen has room to lay.

 

[drex]

I have had successful supercedures in Sept.

 

[Beefriendly]

I have had successful supercedures in Sept.

Aye lad and you live in tropical Essex...get a bit further North and it's already getting a bit too parky for any more of that multiple partner hanky-panky malarky.
Drones have all been evicted.

 

[Millet]

Aye lad and you live in tropical Essex...get a bit further North and it's already getting a bit too parky for any more of that multiple partner hanky-panky malarky.
Drones have all been evicted.

It was that cold in Northumberland last night the blue gas bottles in the caravan lost the will to live...

 

[drex]

Thanks BF, I love being called lad as I draw my pension . My learning disabled adult son calls that malarkey " the mucky stuff" , which description I like too!
The OP lives in Sussex

 

[oliver90owner]

Beano is a comic. Of course virgins will very likely get mated at this time of the year - most unknown supercedures go through with no problem at all at this time of the year. Just needs a couple of warm days for mating.

Mid-September is renowned for fair weather - there may be some poor autumns, but remember, the oceans have been warmed during the summer, so temperatures are likely better in the autumn, than spring (where winds tend to be cooler)

Additionally, with supercedure the old queen might remain all winter, so is not discarded (by the workers) until the new queen is, at least, a proven egg-layer. That is what supercedure is all about - a seamless progression from one queen to the next generation. Bees are more clever than the average beekeeper - they would not retain an infertile queen and initiate the certain death knell for the colony! You may have!

A beginner needs to know that all larvae, after pupation, do not hatch - they emerge. Eggs hatch. There are a lot of non-beginner beekeepers that don’t seem to know that - you see them all the while - writing ‘hatch’ instead of using the proper term. Not very clever, if they are expecting to actually educate the beginners, is it?

My advice is always to think carefully before breaking down all queen cells. It is usually the wrong thing to do. Better to ask on here first if you are not sure. But do be selective of those you take advice from and think through all the possible outcomes before acting. There are a lot of unthinking beekeepers giving advice on the forum.

That means those that have congratulated you on removing the queen cell are quite possibly encouraging poor beekeeping. The information you might glean from the forum may be worth exactly what you paid for it - nothing!

The bees may well try again, to supercede, this time later than the one you pulled down! If there is doubt about the fecundity of the queen (bees often know better than the beekeeper) and they do not manage to supercede, you may find a drone layer in there in the spring.

RAB

 

[beeno]

Concentrate RAB post 3 is mostly about drones.

 

[Cuckmere couple]

thanks all

so i have at least learnt that supersedure is different to swarming. i was panicking that with a capped cell, the old queen (who was bought from paiyyynes this year and is doing v well) would go and felt i was lucky to find her on the day i found a capped q cell

i initially removed the q cell and some frames to a nuc and left her in the hive whilst i sought advice...didnt want her to leave and the new q emerge and not mate

tough to know

 

[Cuckmere couple]

so...i think it is a supersedure

have just read this

http://www.dave-cushman.net/bee/supersedure.html

and it fits

bugger, should have left alone

didnt realise both would co exist until spring

 

[oliver90owner]

I didn’t say they would. They may co-exist for several months, but the workers will decide if and when a queen is discarded. The other (unlikely) possibility is that of finding emergency queen cells, rather than supercedure - if the queen was to croak suddenly. The bees would know if there was someting wrong with their only egg-layer.

You will notice that any hive that is superceding will not have thrown out its drones. You may know that drones often swap colonies, so would not all be weaklings or of limited genetic diversity. As I say, bees are more clever than the ‘comical’ replies about there being no drones. Some colonies even take drones through the winter. Uncommon, but it does occur. Why? Ask the bees why. Likely because they may be needed....

You should soon recognise the rubbish posters from their silly ideas. The comic once insisted her queen laid eggs at a fantastic rate (~5000/day) until a whole brood box was totally filled with BIAS and then she had a rest for a week or ten days. Some live in cloud cuckoo land, but post as though they are sane beekeepers, to beginners. Watch out for them, they don’t think!

RAB

RAB

 

[Walrus]

so...i think it is a supersedure

have just read this

http://www.dave-cushman.net/bee/supersedure.html

and it fits

bugger, should have left alone

didnt realise both would co exist until spring

Your queen is current year isn't it, and you said all was well in the colony? Bees are not infallible (like certain all-knowing members of this forum) and things can go wrong naturally.

Sometimes the weather in this country is not kind. Sometimes the virgin gets poorly mated and the mother queen gets booted out early.

If you are worried about your queen, which when you asked for advice you didn't seem to be, then you can re-queen with a mated laying queen using a push-in cage.

I hope it works out and if I have led you down the path of joke beekeeping I apologise.

 

[Swarm]

I marked a late queen this time last year, there was an unmarked queen in there this Spring.
Supersedure is something that is more often missed because brood inspections have ceased and don't believe there are no drones about.
If you introduce a new queen, the bees will sometimes try to bring on their own. If they persist in this behaviour then something ain't right.

 

[Cuckmere couple]

this is an overwintered nuc from last year (from payyyynes) and has been excellent

she is still laying and has about 6 frames of BIA

will check again this weekend but not sure what to do if another charged cell....its too late i think for it to emerge and mate

 

[drex]

So, why are the bees doing it then?
I try to work with my bees rather than against them.
My old mentor used to say, " if in doubt leave it to the bees" . Has got me out of many sticky situations, since.

 

[REDWOOD]

Supersedure isn't always about laying rate, it could be thay don't like that blob of paint on her back, a dodgy leg or antenna

 

[Cuckmere couple]

yes

i think as its the 4th time it is supersedure and its only ever 1 queen cell...not even 2

advice is destroy them or leave it to bees

will inspect today or tomorrow and no idea what to do if i find another charged cell now

 

[Cuckmere couple]

end result of this...

was that the queen did start to fail early this year...brood amount dropping etc

she had been v prolific all summer and we had two supers from her colony

now replaced with a mated queen which is accepted and laying/
!

 

[Brigsy]

Good to hear. I have a new queen this spring, who isn't the one I put to bed last Autumn!