Buoyant roadside honey sales since lockdown

[ericbeaumont]

If you by directly from his home, there is no secret of where the honey comes from... also it means buyers are locals.

Home? How do you know? He? How can you be certain that it's his honey? From? Can you be certain that the honey wasn't unloaded from the back of an old Transit just back from the far side of Europe?

There are plenty of confused beekeepers out there and legislation is complex enough without this madness that will lead straight to the erosion of the reputation of good local honey.

For pity's sake, forget how Bridgend or Bromley interpret the regs., label your honey accurately and with pride and forget any small-print which may excuse you from the job; if a beekeeper can't be bothered to do that they shouldn't sell honey and muddy the waters for the rest of us.

PS: local means not much these days and a broad market is an advantage to sales at good prices .

 

[Curly green finger's]

 

[Erichalfbee]

Home? How do you know? He? How can you be certain that it's his honey? From? Can you be certain that the honey wasn't unloaded from the back of an old Transit just back from the far side
There are plenty of confused beekeepers out there and legislation is complex enough without this madness that will lead straight to the erosion of the reputation of good local honey.

For pity's sake, forget how Bridgend or Bromley interpret the regs., label your honey accurately and with pride and forget any small-print which may excuse you from the job; if a beekeeper can't be bothered to do that they shouldn't sell honey and muddy the waters for the rest of us.

PS: local means not much these days and a broad market is an advantage to sales at good prices .

Of course you should label your honey but my point was that legally you don’t have to.

 

[enrico]

Of course you should label your honey but my point was that legally you don’t have to.

I agree. I think we all do and I was not looking for a way out, I was just amazed that you didn't have to if you were selling to unknown people.

 

[ericbeaumont]

Of course you should label your honey but my point was that legally you don’t have to.

Well, Dani, to accept that prepacked food must be labelled with info. does not lead to a conclusion that non-prepacked foods need no label, and I haven't seen anything that confirms such a view.

The Business Companion page on Labelling of non-prepacked foods says this: While non-prepacked foods have far fewer labelling requirements than prepacked foods, any information that must appear follows identical rules as when it appears on a prepacked product.

I cannot locate what is meant by far fewer or any information.

The same link also states that Non-prepacked food will need to be labelled with the following: the name of the food, the allergens present in the food, in the case of a meat product, a meat content declaration (see below), in the case of irradiated food, an irradiated food statement (see below)

That's as far as it goes because if we leave out the last three it leaves only the name of the food as necessary. Even the Food Information Regs. (2014) are evasive and say in 6(4)(a) only that the particulars must appear on a label attached to the food, without defining the particulars!

Madness.

 

[Swarm]

Round and round we go ....
No wonder new beekeepers are confused

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Home? How do you know? He? How can you be certain that it's his honey? From? Can you be certain that the honey wasn't unloaded from the back of an old Transit just back from the far side of Europe?

What makes you think sticking a label on would change that? If you believe it does, I have a few lacoste Tshirts I can let you have at a decent price.

 

[Swarm]

The answer is simple, if you want to put a label on jars you sell from the door, carry on. Do you have to? Obviously not as you don't even have to be registered with TS to do so. People see a sign saying " 'Unny for sale" and choose whether they buy some or not.
I put labels on jars for outlets and for new customers but my regulars are happy with plain jars.

 

[Erichalfbee]

Well, Dani, to accept that prepacked food must be labelled with info. does not lead to a conclusion that non-prepacked foods need no label, and I haven't seen anything that confirms such a view.

The Business Companion page on Labelling of non-prepacked foods says this: While non-prepacked foods have far fewer labelling requirements than prepacked foods, any information that must appear follows identical rules as when it appears on a prepacked product.

I cannot locate what is meant by far fewer or any information.

The same link also states that Non-prepacked food will need to be labelled with the following: the name of the food, the allergens present in the food, in the case of a meat product, a meat content declaration (see below), in the case of irradiated food, an irradiated food statement (see below)

That's as far as it goes because if we leave out the last three it leaves only the name of the food as necessary. Even the Food Information Regs. (2014) are evasive and say in 6(4)(a) only that the particulars must appear on a label attached to the food, without defining the particulars!

Madness.

Well I have regular customers who collect from the door. I save their honey in 3lb tubs. I never label them. Similarly I have had them bring back their containers to be filled from the extractor while they wait.
No point in arguing about the legality simply because you disagree with it.
Swarm has it. Do it if you want to but you don’t have to

 

[Swarm]

Well I was going to say my regulars all fetch their empty jars back and they know how difficult it is to clean them after a label has been stuck on ....
But that would only open another debate
Too late, sorry.

 

[ericbeaumont]

What makes you think sticking a label on would change that? If you believe it does, I have a few lacoste Tshirts I can let you have at a decent price.

It's not what I think that matters, but what the regs require of us all. So far, I'm no wiser and no wisdom has emerged.

 

[ericbeaumont]

No point in arguing about the legality simply because you disagree with it.
Do it if you want to but you don’t have to

It's a long way from an argument and I'd agree with anything if it could be shown to be lawful, but so far all I get is smoke and mirrors and hearsay.

 

[Swarm]

Having attended a talk given by EH and TS, I know where I stand as I had it from the horses mouth. You could even have a bucket on the door and pour off honey into a container your customer supplies, agree a price and that's it.

 

[smitten]

Having attended a talk given by EH and TS, I know where I stand as I had it from the horses mouth. You could even have a bucket on the door and pour off honey into a container your customer supplies, agree a price and that's it.

I can buy that as 'not pre-packaged' as you are essentially selling it loose and it is not feasible to label. But surely if it is already in jars and handed to a customer then it is 'pre-packaged'. Or am I missing something?

 

[Dolcoath]

Two dazzling inaccuracies/untruths here which makes me question the whole thing
FERA is a government body, not privately owned.
CCD is a phenomenon only occuring in the USA. no recorded or reported cases in the UK

On 1 April 2015 the business and operations of the Food and Environment Research Agency (Fera), an Executive Agency of Defra, transferred to Fera Science Limited (FSL), a Joint Venture (JV) between Defra and Capita. Their website is at www.fera.co.uk.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

On 1 April 2015 the business and operations of the Food and Environment Research Agency (Fera), an Executive Agency of Defra, transferred to Fera Science Limited (FSL), a Joint Venture (JV) between Defra and Capita. Their website is at www.fera.co.uk.

I stand by both statements.
Whenever a job vacancy occurs with APHA it is advertised as an inter office transfer/promotion opportunity in the restricted Civil service Jobs site, officers can transfer in or out without any restrictions.

 

[ericbeaumont]

Having attended a talk given by EH and TS, I know where I stand as I had it from the horses mouth. You could even have a bucket on the door and pour off honey into a container your customer supplies, agree a price and that's it.

I hear you, Steve, but you're standing in South Wales and of the 339 UK councils my London Borough of Hackney horse is likely to tell a different story; I'll ask it.

 

[Antipodes]

I can buy that as 'not pre-packaged' as you are essentially selling it loose and it is not feasible to label. But surely if it is already in jars and handed to a customer then it is 'pre-packaged'. Or am I missing something?

Smitten, from what I can see, yes, they are both pre-packed, but there seems to be a difference in requirements between "pre-packed" for sale at (for example), a retail outlet and "pre-packed for direct sale" (say by the beekeeper at their own premises where they pre-packed it into the jars for sale at that place).

Then, like you say, there is "loose" which probably is like we have here where the beekeeper or shop has honey in a large bucket or mellower, and the customer comes along with their own bottle or bucket and pays by the kilogram. That's very common to see here in health food shops.

Changes on the way?

https://www.lexology.com/library/detail.aspx?g=c205e59c-6678-408e-85ff-15f44f71bd26

 

[beeno]

What do folks put on the label re "storage conditions"?

Did not realise that was a condition. Will put for next year store in larder - me thinks.

 

[beeno]

Trading Standards Institute Advice
Labelling of honey
This advice applies to all sales of honey to consumers and food businesses… (all that was stated by Enrico).
Where honey is sold loose or prepacked for direct sale (sold from the premises on which it was packed), the labelling information may appear on a label, ticket or notice that can be clearly seen by the purchaser.
Full document: www.bromley.gov.uk
In our case it will be the purchaser of a jar or two!