Hot Wax Dipping of hives and equipment

Plenty of honey · Dec 16, 2016

Interested in anyones experiences and results with this process.
I am currently painting a load of hives up and wonder if this is really something i should be looking to move to for the future.
Theres is a really good info sheet on this i was sent from an australian beekeeper
its : https://rirdc.infoservices.com.au/downloads/01-051

looking to do this properly, one would need a fair size tank or vat that could take entire bases, hive bodies and roof parts.

The cost of set up can be a fair bit, tank burner, safety gear etc etc but i am more interested to know about how the hive parts that were treated now look after years of being in the field with no further maintenance.

I do know that paraffin wax here is now banned and a substitute and apparently safer non carcinogenic microcrystalline substitute is a good equivalent.

A friend of mine, who keeps bees in Portugal and the uk has dipped his hives and said "i will never look back, much better than painting".
His dipping tank in a cut down oil drum, sitting on concrete blocks. The specialised heat regulating device, consists of moving logs further in or out of the fire that burns directly underneath.

Whats everyones experiences please.

REDWOOD · Dec 16, 2016

I don't think molten wax is hot enough to eradicate foul brood

Finman · Dec 16, 2016

.

The temp to kill AFB need to be over 130 C.
Boiling point of paraffine is 340C. Sl you can heat the paraffine ovet 130 C.

Just paint wood with paraffine. I have tried paraffine oil to protect natural plywood of bee cleaner. Plywood took heavy black mould.

What I have read about praffine boiling, it is dangerous. Wax can catch the frame.
.

Noddy · Dec 16, 2016

I don't think the OP is asking about dipping in hot wax to cure/prevent FB, rather that dipping may be a better option than painting for weatherproofing/preserving the wood.....

Finman · Dec 16, 2016

Noddy said:
I don't think the OP is asking about dipping in hot wax to cure/prevent FB, rather that dipping may be a better option than painting for weatherproofing/preserving the wood.....

I can read English, and I answered to boath questions. lets go to basics....

That Australuan report was about sterilizing AFB.

Wax does not, what ever the wax is, protect wood against weather.

Wood acts between dry and wet. In sun the wood makes small splits, when it shrinks. Paints purpose is to seal the small spores and splits, that water and dirt does not enter inside the wood. Then moisture push the paint layer off, if it is not in condition.

I have seen "naturally painted" bee boxes in google. They look terrible after couple of years. Such " coat" does not give any protection to wood.

When wooden box is wet, it is to bees like wet cloath on the human.
.

Finman · Dec 16, 2016

.
Ckuc
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Plenty of honey · Dec 16, 2016

Finman said:
I can read English, and I answered to boath questions. lets go to basics....

That Australuan report was about sterilizing AFB.

Wax does not, what ever the wax is, protect wood against weather.

Wood acts between dry and wet. In sun the wood makes small splits, when it shrinks. Paints purpose is to seal the small spores and splits, that water and dirt does not enter inside the wood. Then moisture push the paint layer off, if it is not in condition.

I have seen "naturally painted" bee boxes in google. They look terrible after couple of years. Such " coat" does not give any protection to wood.

When wooden box is wet, it is to bees like wet cloath on the human.
.

I agree Finman, but does the wood not expel the water when its heated to above 100 degrees C, (above the boiling point of water), and replace it with the wax, that penetrates the surface of the wood. This is my main question really.
However, if it did treat against or help against possible AFB spores, well surely that must be a good thing? The temperature is said to be above 130 degrees when treating hives and materials.
Thanks for the pictures, thats exactly like i have seen other boxes treated the same way!! they dont look very nice but at the end of the day, does that really matter if their well protected due to the wax treatment!!???

Finman · Dec 16, 2016

.
It depends, what image you want to your hives. Unprotected wood is not long living.

N

Finman · Dec 16, 2016

Plenty of honey said:
I agree Finman, but does the wood not expel the water when its heated to above 100 degrees C, (above the boiling point of water), and replace it with the wax, that penetrates the surface of the wood. This is my main question really.

Wax does not seal the cracks in the wood, what is the main purpose of the paint: to protect the wood from rottening.

Wax goes inside the wood fibres.

Fig: Structure of the tree wood

-

Plenty of honey · Dec 16, 2016

Finman said:
Wax does not seal the cracks in the wood, what is the main purpose of the paint: to protect the wood from rottening.

Wax goes inside the wood fibres.
-

Ok, so if "wax goes inside the wood fibres" surely this is a better treatment than painting??

Finman · Dec 16, 2016

Plenty of honey said:
Ok, so if "wax goes inside the wood fibres" surely this is a better treatment than painting??

You go for it....

kighill · Dec 16, 2016

I thought about doing this a couple of years ago but did not go ahead. The videos I saw on YouTube involved dipping the boxes then immediately painting them whilst hot.
This action pulled the paint into the wood making it much easier to paint and making repeat painting less of a necessity. I did find one or two videos which showed the results of hot wax dipping and painting during and after when the boxes had weathered.
Although you may not wish to paint the hives my plan was to dip and then paint. The boxes I saw being done were made of pine so without such protection would of been short lived. My plan was using Cedar hives made from English Cedar which is not comparable to Western Red Cedar.
The plan was scuppered when I decided I am moving over towards Poly hives.
Good luck please let us know should you decide to dip or dip and paint.

stevebrowning · Dec 16, 2016

Plenty of honey said:
Interested in anyones experiences and results with this process.
I am currently painting a load of hives up and wonder if this is really something i should be looking to move to for the future.
Theres is a really good info sheet on this i was sent from an australian beekeeper
its : https://rirdc.infoservices.com.au/downloads/01-051

looking to do this properly, one would need a fair size tank or vat that could take entire bases, hive bodies and roof parts.

The cost of set up can be a fair bit, tank burner, safety gear etc etc but i am more interested to know about how the hive parts that were treated now look after years of being in the field with no further maintenance.

I do know that paraffin wax here is now banned and a substitute and apparently safer non carcinogenic microcrystalline substitute is a good equivalent.

A friend of mine, who keeps bees in Portugal and the uk has dipped his hives and said "i will never look back, much better than painting".
His dipping tank in a cut down oil drum, sitting on concrete blocks. The specialised heat regulating device, consists of moving logs further in or out of the fire that burns directly underneath.

Whats everyones experiences please.

You could ask one of the Canadian Beefarmers you follow on Instagram, I think beeman1979 wax dips his boxes and doesn't paint them

user 6228 · Dec 16, 2016

Plenty of honey said:
Ok, so if "wax goes inside the wood fibres" surely this is a better treatment than painting??

if the wax replaces the air in the wood it makes it conduct more heat.
water logged wood conducts more heat.
from a heat conductance point of view its best to paint it or coat it in resin on the outside. The bees coat it in resin on the inside

mazzamazda · Dec 16, 2016

Ok just for you Richard! Health and safety out of the window, all I can say dipping with hot paraffin works, lasts around 25-30 years with no extra painting required, doesnt take in water and as far as I understand boils out the water and replaces it with paraffin. Works out at around £1 per hive and takes around 10 minutes to do the whole hive.

mazzamazda · Dec 16, 2016

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Hivemaker. · Dec 16, 2016

Good photograph Mark, where do you buy the bulk paraffin wax from?

mazzamazda · Dec 16, 2016

Hivemaker. said:
Good photograph Mark, where do you buy the bulk paraffin wax from?

I buy it from Portugal, it costs around £1.50 a kilo, not cheap but a couple of 5kg blocks will do around 30 deep brood boxes.

maddydog · Dec 16, 2016

SWMBO would have a fit if I did that :icon_204-2:

Fusion_power · Dec 17, 2016

Some beekeepers here say to use beeswax because of physical properties. Most of the recipes to mix wax involve about 1/3 pine rosin combined with either 2/3 paraffin or 1/3 paraffin and 1/3 beeswax. Dipping temperature is suggested as 160 to 165 C. Once wax dipped, paint immediately while hot which will suck the paint into the wood. Treated boxes are good for about 40 years of use.

Rosin can be purchased in bulk on ebay and amazon. Paraffin may be a bit more difficult to locate depending on where you are. Higher melting point wax is usually recommended. Avoid wax that has dies or perfumes, not because the bees don't like it, but because it causes foaming when the wax is hot. If done properly, yes, it kills AFB spores.

Hot Wax Dipping of hives and equipment

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