What would you do for this failing colony?

[MasMassive]

Please can you give me some advice? This is a 2 year old colony which is now failing. There isn't a queen and today I killed 2 wax moth larvae. Should I introduce a new queen or do the colony look too feeble? If the latter is the case, what would you do to save the bees or if all else fails to save the comb from wax moth? I do have a new swarm caught about a week ago, however, I'm still so upset as this was a lovely gentle, productive colony. I would love to be able to save them. Thank for you all your recommendations

 

[emoclewbee]

Past the point of saving MasMassive.
Shake out the bees and put the frames somewhere safe until you need them.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

totally doomed, shake them all out - they will beg their way into the other colony

 

[madasafish]

Not worth effort.

 

[pargyle]

After you have shaken the bees out put the frames in a spare box and hit them with a sulphur burn - that will kill all the stages of wax moth - from eggs to hatchlings. Otherwise the moth larvae will destroy the comb in no time (and the box they are in if they really get a hold, You can then save the frames for future use. Much safer treatment than freezing.

You might need to consider why the colony failed - were they treated for varroa in the autumn ?

 

[Garry R]

Basically not enough bees in this "colony" to be able to do anything. Wouldn't be able to support a queen never mind raise brood. I would say that this colony was not going to be viable for quite some time, In the words of my PhD supervisor 50 years ago when experiments went wrong "Moisten lips and start afresh"' It was good advice and in the end always saved time and wasteful effort.

 

[madasafish]

Err

Basically not enough bees in this "colony" to be able to do anything. Wouldn't be able to support a queen never mind raise brood. I would say that this colony was not going to be viable for quite some time, In the words of my PhD supervisor 50 years ago when experiments went wrong "Moisten lips and start afresh"' It was good advice and in the end always saved time and wasteful effort.

Err.. It could be saved with a Queen in a double min nuc (Kieler) but it requires some skill and experience..
No beginner has a hope pf doing hat successfully in my view- took me years to overwinter them successfully.

 

[ericbeaumont]

2 year old colony which is now failing

Yes, this colony is finished, but before the same happens to your next colony, ask yourself why this one declined.

I'll tell you: varroa. Infestation is evident from the remaining sealed brood cells, where bees have attempted to rip open cappings to remove brood they recognise to be damaged.

The loss of this lovely, gentle colony has upset you, but set that aside and look to escalate your beekeeping knowledge. For example, your recent swarm will have arrived carrying varroa, but until they produce sealed brood you have a window of opportunity to treat.

 

[Mabee]

Looks like some discouloured, molten larvae in a few cells. It would be worth calling the bee inspector. This hive isn't worth saving but it is worth checking why it has failed.

Looks like EFB to me.

 

[Mabee]

The sealed brood also looking bad.

 

[Ely]

Not enough bees to be able to nurture the brood if you introduced a new queen. The bees will die off before they could build the brood up and the new queen would die along with them, wasting your time and money.

 

[MasMassive]

Past the point of saving MasMassive.
Shake out the bees and put the frames somewhere safe until you need them.

totally doomed, shake them all out - they will beg their way into the other co

Yes, this colony is finished, but before the same happens to your next colony, ask yourself why this one declined.

I'll tell you: varroa. Infestation is evident from the remaining sealed brood cells, where bees have attempted to rip open cappings to remove brood they recognise to be damaged.

The loss of this lovely, gentle colony has upset you, but set that aside and look to escalate your beekeeping knowledge. For example, your recent swarm will have arrived carrying varroa, but until they produce sealed brood you have a window of opportunity to treat.

I treated them with varromed (first time I used it as I always used apivar until now). I'll treat the new colony.

Do you really think it is EFB? Doesn't that put the new swarm at risk too?

 

[MasMassive]

If it is EFB, I would not have to declare it (I'm in France). Le Traité Rustica de l'Apicuteur (bee bible) tells me I can disinfect all the frames by soaking them for half an hour in a solution of 5.5l water, 250ml bleach and 30ml of Teepol then spinning in extractor before leaving to dry. Would that kill all stages of wax moth too or should I freeze frames first? If anyone talks about burning the equipment I will not be able to "Moisten lips and start afresh" I will be too busy crying!

 

[JamezF]

If it is EFB, I would burn the frames regardless I think. Recover the wax and turn it into candles if you wish, but disinfected or otherwise it's far too easy for infection to hide away somewhere the bleach doesn't get to it.

James

 

[drex]

After you have shaken the bees out put the frames in a spare box and hit them with a sulphur burn - that will kill all the stages of wax moth - from eggs to hatchlings. Otherwise the moth larvae will destroy the comb in no time (and the box they are in if they really get a hold, You can then save the frames for future use. Much safer treatment than freezing.

You might need to consider why the colony failed - were they treated for varroa in the autumn ?

I use sulphur, but I believe it does not kill eggs, hence I repeat it 2 weeks later.

 

[ericbeaumont]

discouloured, molten larvae in a few cells

Do you really think it is EFB? Doesn't that put the new swarm at risk too?

EFB is generally diagnosed by distorted or melted advanced open brood, which you do not have.

AFB ID includes sunken, greasy cappings of sealed brood, which you may have, but I'm not certain whether Mabee has spotted the real danger, or whether those sunken cells contain pollen.

Test by opening a few; if they are brood, dip a matchstick in and see what comes out.

 

[Mabee]

EFB is generally diagnosed by distorted or melted advanced open brood, which you do not have.

AFB ID includes sunken, greasy cappings of sealed brood, which you may have, but I'm not certain whether Mabee has spotted the real danger, or whether those sunken cells contain pollen.

Test by opening a few; if they are brood, dip a matchstick in and see what comes out.

i’m pretty sure I see distorted, melted open brood in addition to sunken cells in the screenshots I posted, I thought more likely EFB in that case but wouldn’t rule out AFB either. Either way pretty sickly looking and worth investigating.

 

[pargyle]

I use sulphur, but I believe it does not kill eggs, hence I repeat it 2 weeks later.

Yes ... it does appear to kill the eggs ... it's sulphur dioxide gas which is toxic. There are some sources that say it does not kill eggs... Pays yer money and takes yer choice ! I treat my stored boxes with sulphur and then give them a go with Dipel - belt and braces ?